Brexit Deal

[Phil the Brit]

Well, it is a 310-mile border mainly through rural areas, with a lot of complex interactions (with roads dipping in and out, for example), so while it would be possible to build a 310-mile wall/fence, and also to check every single person and vehicle crossing the border, in practice, I think it would be impractical (and really would cause a problem in relations between the Republic and NI). If you are concerned about illegal immigration, the first solution is to have strong controls on the movement of people across the Irish Sea, where everybody making that crossing would need to show appropriate paperwork. The second, more generally useful step would be to introduce identity cards and empower the police to check the status of everyone they encounter.
For me, immigration was the least important reason for wanting to leave the EU. Illegal immigration has been broadly unaffected by our EU status because of our non-participation in the Schengen Agreement. Peoiple would be coming from France by boat or overstaying their visas whether we were in the EU or not. And while I would have liked legal immigration from within the EU to have been better controlled (which it could have been anyway), in general I am in favour of immigration at a sensible rate.

So, inevitably there needs to be a control at all ports/airports in Southern Ireland to stop them getting into there. The problem is that they are legally allowed there so where would this control happen. There also needs to be a check done on all lorries coming in, or, it this already happening?
I am genuinly confused about the mechanics of how this is supposed to happen. Please help me understand.

 

[GeoffCapes]

The thing people that we seem to be concerned about coming into this country aren't the EU citizens. It's the Syrians, and Somalians and, well, basically 'economic migrants masquerading as refugees', they're not supposed to be in any of the EU countries so I don't suppose any border across Ireland will make much difference, as it's even harder to get to Ireland than it is to the UK.

Just my 2 penneth.

 

[CatmanV2]

Could a sausage roll be considered a pie then?

Wholly encased. You're really not getting this are you?

C

 

[CatmanV2]

Perhaps we need a pie chart?

A venn diagram, surely </straight bat>

C

 

[GeoffCapes]

Wholly encased. You're really not getting this are you?

C

Just trolling!

 

[CatmanV2]

Just trolling!

Sausage (t)rolling?

C

 

[MarkMas]

So, inevitably there needs to be a control at all ports/airports in Southern Ireland to stop them getting into there. The problem is that they are legally allowed there so where would this control happen. There also needs to be a check done on all lorries coming in, or, it this already happening?
I am genuinly confused about the mechanics of how this is supposed to happen. Please help me understand.

As I say, the way it could work for the UK is:
(a) not to worry about any legal (EU or otherwise) or illegal immigration into the Republic of Ireland, because the UK has no control over this.
(b) because a people-proof border between the Republic and NI is impractical, there is no point trying to enforce this with border posts and lorry checks, when anyone can just stroll across a field
(c) so don't even try to make it impossible for illegal immigrants to enter NI from the Republic
(d) but make it hard for them to work, rent, lie low, etc - NI is very heavily policed, and this should be very possible;
(e) deter with 1 year in jail followed by deportation
(f) strongly control the people border between NI and the rest of the UK (basically planes and ferries, so fairly easy)
(g) plus UK identity cards, random immigration status stops (illegals get 1 year in jail followed by deportation)
(h) plus a more sensible asylum system, that supports genuine refugees but rapidly processes fake refugees (this is hard)
(i) plus a straightforward and welcoming legal immigration system that encourages working visits, longer-stay would-be immigrants, and newly naturalised citizens from all over the world, not just white Europeans.
- One of my main objections to the EU is that it is fundamentally a racist enclave that facilitates trade and movement amongst (mainly white) Europeans, and thus discriminates against Asians and Africans.

 

[MarkMas]

(i) plus a straightforward and welcoming legal immigration system that encourages working visits, longer-stay would-be immigrants, and newly naturalised citizens from all over the world, not just white Europeans.

The welcome could include a nice shepherds pie, or cottage pie.

 

[allandwf]

Wholly encased. You're really not getting this are you?

C

Beef Wellington?

 

[CatmanV2]

Beef Wellington?

Oh now that's a thought! Good one!
C

 

[Phil the Brit]

As I say, the way it could work for the UK is:
(a) not to worry about any legal (EU or otherwise) or illegal immigration into the Republic of Ireland, because the UK has no control over this.
(b) because a people-proof border between the Republic and NI is impractical, there is no point trying to enforce this with border posts and lorry checks, when anyone can just stroll across a field
(c) so don't even try to make it impossible for illegal immigrants to enter NI from the Republic
(d) but make it hard for them to work, rent, lie low, etc - NI is very heavily policed, and this should be very possible;
(e) deter with 1 year in jail followed by deportation
(f) strongly control the people border between NI and the rest of the UK (basically planes and ferries, so fairly easy)
(g) plus UK identity cards, random immigration status stops (illegals get 1 year in jail followed by deportation)
(h) plus a more sensible asylum system, that supports genuine refugees but rapidly processes fake refugees (this is hard)
(i) plus a straightforward and welcoming legal immigration system that encourages working visits, longer-stay would-be immigrants, and newly naturalised citizens from all over the world, not just white Europeans.
- One of my main objections to the EU is that it is fundamentally a racist enclave that facilitates trade and movement amongst (mainly white) Europeans, and thus discriminates against Asians and Africans.

How much of what you have written is covered by the withdrawal agreement? I again, genuinely do not know. I am concerned by every man and his dog just walking into our country by this route without a by your leave by anyone.

 

[CatmanV2]

The welcome could include a nice shepherds pie, or cottage pie.

Well that would certainly help the deportation.....

C

 

[Phil the Brit]

The thing people that we seem to be concerned about coming into this country aren't the EU citizens. It's the Syrians, and Somalians and, well, basically 'economic migrants masquerading as refugees', they're not supposed to be in any of the EU countries so I don't suppose any border across Ireland will make much difference, as it's even harder to get to Ireland than it is to the UK.

Just my 2 penneth.

How is it harder to get into Ireland than it is to the UK. What extra checks are done on these Irish routes?
Again, a genuine question as I do not know anything about check done in Southern Ireland.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Is a beef wellington, just a sausage roll of the roast beef?

 

[midlifecrisis]

I'm surprised that no-one has posted a pie chart of some description say how much something compares to something else... so here's the first...

 

[allandwf]

Is a beef wellington, just a sausage roll of the roast beef?

But it's totally enclosed, so surely not?

 

[GeoffCapes]

How is it harder to get into Ireland than it is to the UK. What extra checks are done on these Irish routes?
Again, a genuine question as I do not know anything about check done in Southern Ireland.

I was referring to purely the distance. To get into Ireland you have to be smuggled onto a ferry for countless hours. The Channel is 55 minutes and however, long on the train.

 

[MarkMas]

 

[allandwf]

I was referring to purely the distance. To get into Ireland you have to be smuggled onto a ferry for countless hours. The Channel is 55 minutes and however, long on the train.

Then you will be in Ireland, and to get to mainland UK you will arrive in Stranraer! The land that time forgot. Surely a deterrent in its own right.

 

[2b1ask1]

Local lad...