Diagnosing the F1 System

tonycharente

Junior Member
Messages
76
Is it possible with the X431 to tell the car (e.g. a Gransport) that a new clutch has been installed? My mechanic is currently using a tool where he can adjust the KISS point but after installing a new clutch, there is no possibility to reset the car’s memory, so the car still thinks that an old clutch is fitted
Someone can probably reply better than me on this, but I think so. As I have a new clutch I'm anxious not to accidently change the New Clutch Closing Position so daren't go too far into the gearbox menu in case I do...
 

tulit

Junior Member
Messages
84
You can tell if a new clutch is in based on the new clutch closed position and the current clutch position. You can find these on the standard datagram.

The catch here is that this assumes that (a) new clutch closed position was properly reset when the clutch was put in and (b) no one went in after and tampered with the setting to make it look like a new clutch.

The only way to know for sure is to do a visual measurement of the clutch disk itself!

Sent from my SM-A515W using Tapatalk
 

spkennyuk

Member
Messages
4,930
Is it possible with the X431 to tell the car (e.g. a Gransport) that a new clutch has been installed? My mechanic is currently using a tool where he can adjust the KISS point but after installing a new clutch, there is no possibility to reset the car’s memory, so the car still thinks that an old clutch is fitted
Yes you can use the launch x431 to set up a new clutch. IIRC Its the 1st option from the special functions menu in the TCU module.

I have had no need to use that section but my understanding is that it will clear the clutch closed position point and then read the correct new closed position point from the clutch position sensor. That figure is then writen as the new baseline clutch closed position point which is known as the self calibrated clutch closed position.

There are a few youtube videos kicking around where they have used the launch system to change the clutch on Maserati and Ferrari cars. IIRC forum member lambertis used it when doing his clutch change blog.

Once you start driving the car after you have fitted the new clutch and reset the baseline starting closed position point the car reads the new closed position point with every gear change and reports this as the new clutch closed position. This then allows you to calculate the clutch wear.

The correct formula for working out the clutch wear is:-

Self calibrated clutch closed position number minus the new clutch closed position. Divide that number by 5.56 which is the measurement of the clutch disc minus the metal plate you then multiply this number by 100 to give you the clutch used amount.

Launch as discussed currently uses 7 instead of 5.56 when it calculates the clutch wear so reports an optimistic used rate.

As an example of the above calculation.

Self calibrated clutch closed position reads 21.44

New clutch closed position reads 18.88

Formula is : 21.44 minus 18.88 = 2.56 divided by 5.56 = 0.4604 multiply by 100 = 46% clutch used
 
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tonycharente

Junior Member
Messages
76
Going back a few posts...
Concerning "The mini pro may be missing the options of remote customer diagnostic as an example which you can do with the larget tablet." - my "mini" has the remote customer diagnostic" option.
 

spkennyuk

Member
Messages
4,930
Going back a few posts...
Concerning "The mini pro may be missing the options of remote customer diagnostic as an example which you can do with the larget tablet." - my "mini" has the remote customer diagnostic" option.
I pressume it doesnt come with the golo or easi diag dongles then or the specific brand vehicle adaptors from the large tablet pro kit. So the pro and pro mini are the same just with a smaller tablet and without the dongles and adaptors that the home user probably would not use anyway.
 

philw696

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
14,915
I pressume it doesnt come with the golo or easi diag dongles then or the specific brand vehicle adaptors from the large tablet pro kit. So the pro and pro mini are the same just with a smaller tablet and without the dongles and adaptors that the home user probably would not use anyway.
No they come with all the adaptors.
 

philw696

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
14,915
I pressume it doesnt come with the golo or easi diag dongles then or the specific brand vehicle adaptors from the large tablet pro kit. So the pro and pro mini are the same just with a smaller tablet and without the dongles and adaptors that the home user probably would not use anyway.
 

tonycharente

Junior Member
Messages
76
I pressume it doesnt come with the golo or easi diag dongles then or the specific brand vehicle adaptors from the large tablet pro kit. So the pro and pro mini are the same just with a smaller tablet and without the dongles and adaptors that the home user probably would not use anyway.
I don't understand what you mean by "golo or easi diag dongles" but it does come with a whole load of specific brand vehicle adaptors that seem to relate to pre-ODB2 models (?) sold in the USA (?) and which I'll never use. Ditto a whole bunch of cables to plug into these adaptors. Specifically the adaptors I have are: TOYOTA-17, TOYOTA-22, CHRYSLER-6, HONDA-3, GM VAZ-12, BENZ-38 and BMW-20. Is that the same as the bigger versions? For me it's a complete waste of money and Launch could sell versions without all these wasted items, either for a lot cheaper or else with a bigger margin - or both!
Cheers
Tony
 
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spkennyuk

Member
Messages
4,930
I don't understand what you mean by "golo or easi diag dongles" but it does come with a whole load of specific brand vehicle adaptors that seem to relate to pre-ODB2 models (?) sold in the USA (?) and which I'll never use. Ditto a whole bunch of cables to plug into these adaptors. Specifically the adaptors I have are: TOYOTA-17, TOYOTA-22, CHRYSLER-6, HONDA-3, GM VAZ-12, BENZ-38 and BMW-20. Is that the same as the bigger versions? For me it's a complete waste of money and Launch could sell versions without all these wasted items, either for a lot cheaper or else with a bigger margin - or both!
Cheers
Tony
The golo and easi diag dongles are really for use if your a garage and a customer has a recurring fault. You loan them the dongle and they install a phone app that will read various data streams to help diagnose the issue. The data streams and any error codes can then be sent back to the garage tech with the main tablet to asses.

Its no great loss for the home user. Its something that would be rarely used. It does allow you to have a quick diagnostic tool available in other cars in your family just sat in the glove box incase its needed.

Screen shot shows the two dongles i refer to.79279
 

tonycharente

Junior Member
Messages
76
As mentioned I am also posting on a similar French forum. The guy helping me there provided me with this link ("at your own risk"):-

https://mobile.x431.com/m/sv.aspx?TypeId=36&fid=t8:36:8

Using this I have successfully loaded the Launch application onto my Android (Galaxy) smartphone, it has recognised my Launch sign-in, knows who I am, recognises it's an X431 Pros Mini V3, how long my two year free download period has to run - all looking very good. I get the same screens as on my X431 save for they are missing the lower portion.

HOWEVER what I haven't managed to do is to get it to do my free download.

It shows I have no modules loaded (that's understandable - they are, of course, stored on my x431), that I therefore have 103 modules to update, but when I click on "update " it whirls for a few seconds but nothing downloads, and it returns to the update page. If I click on "renew" I can pay $599 to renew - despite (on the same page) its giving the date of the end of my two years free update period.

Any ideas please ?
Tony
UPDATE : SUCCESS
As I think already raised by "SPKENNYUK", but not taken in by me I'm afraid, the member on the French Maserati forum who is also helping me, asked me whether I'd connected my phone to the dongle BEFORE trying to download the updates. I hadn't, but I have now, and then was able to download the update - tested on the 4200, all works (DTC scan, measure PIS, measure clutch wear, everything.) So now I only need take the dongle with me when I go out.

I did have a problem with having enough space in my phone's internal memory - had to wipe a few applications to create enough space (am still at 15/16 Go used though - the Launch has 32 Go). Does anyone know how (on an Android smartphone, Galaxy A3 in my case) to make it download the updates to my SD card (which has plenty of space remaining) please?
 

philw696

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
14,915
Just sorted a jerky clutch out on a Citroen C4 Grand Picasso that the owner thought was a Automatic.
Can't praise the Launch X431 Pros Mini enough as the car was barely driveable in 1st and Reverse.
I got it after two other places had messed with it so feeling quite pleased.
 

Oneball

Member
Messages
5,475
Just sorted a jerky clutch out on a Citroen C4 Grand Picasso that the owner thought was a Automatic.
Can't praise the Launch X431 Pros Mini enough as the car was barely driveable in 1st and Reverse.
I got it after two other places had messed with it so feeling quite pleased.
What was the problem? I’m guessing they’re a dual clutch.
 

CatmanV2

Member
Messages
37,996
Just sorted a jerky clutch out on a Citroen C4 Grand Picasso that the owner thought was a Automatic.
Can't praise the Launch X431 Pros Mini enough as the car was barely driveable in 1st and Reverse.
I got it after two other places had messed with it so feeling quite pleased.
I keep getting tempted even though I should get the VAG-COM :D [1]

C

[1] Sounds so dirty
 

philw696

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
14,915
What was the problem? I’m guessing they’re a dual clutch.
Out of its parameters.
The first thing I did was put a new battery on as nearly every module had voltage issues.
I'm not a lover of Citroen but now driving on the paddles which are column mounted it drives superbly.
 

CatmanV2

Member
Messages
37,996
It’s VCDS these days, probably for that reason. And you know someone with it...
Yes, but I imagine he uses fairly regularly, being that kind of chap. Never one to let a VAG miss its VCDS....
If, however, he felt like posting it down for a long term loan :D

I'd come and get it but
A) Lockdown
and
B) It would probably be cheaper to buy it than pay for the fuel ;)

You’ve got VAG-COM? Is it sore and oozing?
Not since the new pills kicked in.

C
 

Evo Cymru

Member
Messages
630
Further to this discussion on the Launch X431 system - has anyone used it to adjust the suspension? I notice on the KW suspension site they mention using the SD2 to turn the Skyhook system off when fitting KW3 coil overs:

https://www.kwsuspensions.co.uk/shop/MASERATI_4200_GT_Coupe_03_2002-11_2007__all_4.2_Petrol_291KW_4244ccm_6Ds6M3Ts7Qi0eFJl8*BG3g../56/Street_Performance/35243002

see installation manual part...

Of course this does beg the question whether in the interim you could simply switch the Skyhook off and retain the faster gearshifts and exhaust noise?? Anyone done this with the Launch or SD2/3??