3leftovercrest
Member
- Messages
- 310
Having worked in Quant Finance for a long time, the risk on spread betting and CFD’s are too great for my personal risk tolerance....
Say you had £10-£20k to invest?
- Thread starter FF1078
- Start date
Having worked in Quant Finance for a long time, the risk on spread betting and CFD’s are too great for my personal risk tolerance....
cheshiremaserati
Member
- Messages
- 1,124
And not just you but for many. How many people as private investors know the first thing about spread betting and CFD's? I for one know nothing....."so I'm ooot" as a certain Mr Bannatyne might remark.
Lozzer
Member
- Messages
- 2,285
You're welcome, I'm sick of watching re Dover not being able to cope aft brexit, as if it's the only port in the country, send it to places like hull, its geared up for WT, Southern Self Importance.......again.......
JonW
Member
- Messages
- 3,262
If I could relive my working career, I often think I would have liked to spend enough time working as an analyst or a quant to really understand the markets and then make a living day trading...
I’m amazed at 1% per day after trading costs though... that means roughly able to double your money each year (even with days of losses).
conaero
Forum Owner
- Messages
- 34,640
Small under 1000sqft so they don’t have to pay rates. Well, that’s the case in Chichester.
I have two.
One is 1800sqft but 2 floors so I lease each floor separately.
My company rents one of the upstairs that consists of three offices. I rent the other two as fully serviced.
The other is 900sqft over 2 floors so rent that out to one company.
You have to put down 20% but offices are cheap.
Offices rent for £3500 a month, mortgage for both is £600. Currently all the rent is going back in to the mortgage to pay it off.
Put down £100k on both to purchase.
They don’t go up much in value granted but I think it’s a cracking ROI.
You pay 20% flat rate on rent takings.
Last edited:
GeoffCapes
Member
- Messages
- 14,000
I used Spreadbetting and CFD's for years. Bought my first house with the profits.
When I split with my ex she emptied the back accounts so I was penny less and borrowed a grand just to trade when the banks were in free fall (thank you RBS!) Gave the grand back 4 days later, bought a car and set got enough to put a deposit on a flat.
Then I had a sh*t load in an oil company get suspended so I had to buy the shares or I would have a huge margin call.
That was 10 years ago and have about 100 grand locked up in a still suspended oil company.
That was the final straw for me, and decided to earn money in a more straightforward manner.
And haven't traded since.
outrun
Member
- Messages
- 5,017
I run a PE fund and have some understand, so I’m told of how to play a spread. If I was to invest 20k, which isn’t a lot, provided I was happy to lose it, id look at a long game playing with 5 or so EIS investments that gave me some tax money back and a tax free upside, if there is one. I would look at using a syndicate site such as Syndicate Room for this and expect the returns to take at least 5 years to some back. One or two should win you 10x back, the others will crash and burn but you can see save further by claiming tax relief on the losses. That way the actual risk is about 5k of your 20k but the upside is far more, if you are lucky and it works.
Sorry for the spelling, crappy phone keyboard!
Sorry for the spelling, crappy phone keyboard!
rivarama
Member
- Messages
- 1,102
In your situation, I’d put this in an ISA and buy a FTSE 100 ETF like “ISF” and forget it.
It pays over 4% dividend and is relatively good value given the tough 2018 market performance.
Any other time I would have advised you to buy a global index, but the GBP being so ****** right now that you’ll lose any future gain when (not if) the GBP recovers over time
3leftovercrest
Member
- Messages
- 310
Jon,
£10k per trade plus .5% stamp duty plus £8 for the purchase and £8 for the sale with bid/offer spread less than 30bps is less than 0.7% break even.
Look at how many stocks a day move more than 1.2% intra-day....
Last edited:
rivarama
Member
- Messages
- 1,102
BS!!
90% of retail day traders blow their accounts within 6months. Unless you’re in the 10% - OP do stay away... odds are against you.
rivarama
Member
- Messages
- 1,102
Pro traders feed off people that think they can “find” stocks that move up 1% to make money.
If you knew what you were talking about, you’d realise that the transaction costs you hilighted above are only making your broker (through commissions) and pro traders (through your spread and the fact that your luck only goes so far against the market of pros with year of DT experience) transfer that 10-20k from your account to their accounts.
OP stick to buy and hold strategy - FTSE100 ETF for low transaction and holding cost... watch it grow and pay dividend. Nobody invented anything more powerful than compounded interest (except may be a naturally aspirated V12
rivarama
Member
- Messages
- 1,102
Go speak to real traders - I am not talking Sunday traders or wannabees home office after work retail gamblers, but people that have traded successfully for years.
You will find one common theme: the road is long, painful, humbling and seldom successful for most of them. Most of their success is not necessarily about who understands the market better (that’s just a given for all of them and you will find that none has the same understanding otherwise you would never get a bid to match an ask), but who has the discipline and psychological self control to stick to their trading system.
Before you start trading your own money (as opposed to gambling), I suggest you do.
One rarely becomes a concerto violin player or professional F1 driver by just learning about their craft ;-)
Phil the Brit
Member
- Messages
- 1,499
Believe it or not Dover is the cheapest place to get to. It's closer!
That is also why ports like Margate are now gearing up.
cheshiremaserati
Member
- Messages
- 1,124
Try the series of books based on "The Motley Fools Guide to....." for an initial understanding.
rivarama
Member
- Messages
- 1,102
If you want to get smart and show off on forums, mondaine occasions etc... there are 1000s of good books. Good luck digesting that (take it from someone who’s studied finance and has been investing and trading for 20years)
Once you understand that 99% of professional investors cannot beat the market overtime (fact: only 1% of portfolio managers manage to beat the market over 5years, and that drops when looking at the same over 10yrs) - and once you accept that you most certainly won’t be in that 1% - save yourself time and money and read “how a second grader beat wall street”
It will tell you everything you need to know about passive investing.
conaero
Forum Owner
- Messages
- 34,640
I would say that it’s not the time. The bubble is set to burst, just like it did in the 90’s. Prices are already falling as stock is not selling. Ferrari do seem to be in their own ecosystem granted.
breakeronly
Junior Member
- Messages
- 90
Put 20k on the nose, Laurina in the 1.50 pm at Sandown this afternoon.....win or lose your get your heart fluttering.....lol