Fiat Alfa at it again

conaero

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How to ruin the 4C in one easy swipe, put a Chrysler engine in it, FFS!

Fiat pulled out an unexpected announcement today when it issued a press release confirming a new 4-cylinder turbo petrol engine is to be built at its FMA plant in Pratola Serra, Italy, beginning in early 2013 for initial use by Alfa Romeo.

According to a press release, the engine “will have a displacement of 1.8 litres and a maximum output of 300 hp, setting a new performance standard in its category.†The release also notes it will be compliant with future emissions standards in both Europe (Euro 6) and the U.S.

According to the release, the engine will be of all-aluminium construction and incorporate advanced technologies, including “a 200-bar gasoline direct injection system, dual variable timing and a high-efficiency turbocharger.†Fiat claims the new unit will offer “power-to-weight ratio, fuel efficiency, acoustic and vibrational comfort, and driving performance that are the very best in its category and characteristic of Alfa Romeo engines.

The news that Alfa Romeo is getting a new engine was unexpected, especially as the brand recently introduced the highly-regarded 1.8 TBi direct injection ‘1750' engine. For a loss-making carmaker such as Fiat, which is suffering the effects of ageing models and is reduced to hasty rehashes of Chrysler Group models to try to tide it along, a new 1.8 petrol engine for Alfa Romeo is one of the few items which is not a pressing priority. It is a curious announcement for a management which is obsessed with cutting costs ahead of producing

That scenario has thus led to immediate speculation that Fiat could be poised to built a revised version of Chrysler Group's World Gasoline Engine (WGE) in Italy, although details remain very unclear. The current TBi ‘Family B' unit is built at Pratola Serra alongside FPT's 1.6, 2.0 and twin-turbo 1.9 MultiJet diesels, all of which derive from the same family. Indeed, the TBi engine shares its fundamentals of bore and stroke with the 1.6 and 2.0 diesels. However, all Family B variants have a cast-iron block which would involve significant re-engineering work to convert to an aluminium item, and none in their current form are designed for longitudinal applications.

On the other hand, the WGE family, built in Dundee, Michigan, already features all-aluminium construction and the ability to adapt to both transverse and longitudinal installations. A 1.8-litre variant of the WGE – with bore of 86mm and stroke of 77mm – was previously used in base-model Dodge Calibers, although this version has not been produced since 2009. Nevertheless, the WGE consistently appears as a long-term offering in Chrysler Group presentations, and the 2.0 and 2.4 variants are currently the focus of an intensive re-engineering program which involves the addition of Fiat's acclaimed MultiAir induction system and, in higher-performance variants, direct injection and turbocharging. (With this said, the current TBi unit is also explicitly named in last year's 2010-2014 Business Plan as a core future powertrain component.)

Chrysler's November 2009 powertrain presentation does offer a possible hint that the WGE's 1.8-litre option was, even at that stage, being considered for future high-performance applications. Under a slide entitled “Potential Gasoline Engine Expansion Through 2014â€, it features all three capacities of the WGE, and notes the future of the 1.8 as being in direct injection and turbocharging. (The projected schedule for the engine's debut – less than 18 months away – certainly implies development has been underway for a significant length of time.) The presentation does not offer any clues as to why a WGE-derived engine might be earmarked for Pratola Serra. However, this may simply be a politically-correct announcement – with Fiat frequently chopping and changing its production plans (and the future of Mirafiori once again thrown into doubt), there is every possibility the production of such an engine, should it prove to be a WGE derivative, would in fact take place at Dundee.

If WGE is indeed the future option for Alfa Romeo products – and its first production application will be in the Alfa 4C sports car – it would be a huge gamble for Fiat to take, as the base engine is one of the most derided engines in recent years. WGE is the leftovers of the former Chrysler/Mitsubishi/Hyundai joint venture, the Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance (GEMA). Production began in 2005, but despite its relatively recent design the result was a low-tech and generally unrefined powerplant which is now well off the pace of modern rivals.

According to Alfa Romeo CEO Harald Wester, the new engine marks “an extremely important step for Alfa Romeo, as we continue to reposition our brand and prepare it for global distribution. The United States remains our primary objective as we prepare for a 2013 introduction of our models.†He added that “the dedication of group-wide resources to develop specific powertrain solutions for the specific needs of Alfa Romeo is a reflection of the renewed thrust we are placing on the development of this brand. This is a first step in a series of initiatives to be implemented in the near future which will reconnect Alfa Romeo to its historical roots as a premium Italian sports car brand.â€
 

conaero

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Let's hope so Andy, but you just know that the yank lump will be lurking deep in the engi e bay.
 

Parisien

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The engine is really the heart of any Alfa.......who'd want an engined from the likes of Chrysler.......mind you Rolls Royce had a Yankee engine for years.....;)


P
 

Emtee

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"...If WGE is indeed the future option for Alfa Romeo products – and its first production application will be in the Alfa 4C sports car..."

Where does this particular statement come from as I can't see the step from the statement to it's possible use in the 4C?

Given Fiat have stated their plans to expand AR sales into the US, then I can see a logic to a new generation WGE / multiair / direct injection / turbo platform, and also an italian produced version, but the Euro 6 reg's apply to diesel engines don't they and so would lead to a link with the Giulia and 'flag ship' saloon (well at least certain models within the range) but surely not the 4C as the platform seems to max out at a 2.4L 4 cylinder engine, or am I reading it wrong?
 

Andyk

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61,185
Let's hope so Andy, but you just know that the yank lump will be lurking deep in the engi e bay.

So the opriginal plan to use the current Alfa 1.8 turbo engine has changed.....Is was it a 1.6......Memory no what it used to be........Alfa needs to be really careful with the 4C as the car is such a lightweight the enngine needs to be as well.
 

Emtee

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This from this months Auto Italia...

ALFA 4C FOR 2013.

Alfa Romeo stated officially that the 4C will be released in 2013. A technical flagship model, the 4C two-seater, mid-engined coupe has a target weight of 850kg, with 60% at the rear. Powered by the Guiletta Quadrifoglio Verde 1750 turbo, with TCT double-clutch gearbox, the top speed should be over 155mph; 0 - 60mph in four seconds.
 

markp4200

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331
I said it before and I'll say it again.
How likely is it that the 4C will end up looking as the concept/pre-production model?
If the engine is subject to revision, then what chance the rest of the car?
Bear in mind it's being built to the £40K price point; other things may have to be considered.
 

conaero

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34,639
this from this months auto italia...

alfa 4c for 2013.

alfa romeo stated officially that the 4c will be released in 2013. A technical flagship model, the 4c two-seater, mid-engined coupe has a target weight of 850kg, with 60% at the rear. Powered by the guiletta quadrifoglio verde 1750 turbo, with tct double-clutch gearbox, the top speed should be over 155mph; 0 - 60mph in four seconds.


i hope so myles
 

conaero

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i said it before and i'll say it again.
How likely is it that the 4c will end up looking as the concept/pre-production model?
If the engine is subject to revision, then what chance the rest of the car?
Bear in mind it's being built to the £40k price point; other things may have to be considered.

i hope not mark
 

conaero

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In reality I dont think Alfa can stray too much from what they offered, to be fair, they must have leant from the past Brera episode.

The interior will change and be far more simpler, that I can understand and dont have an issue with, but where they will C0CK it up is on price and engine.

I am still going to stick with it. According to the Alfa dealership I place my 'provisional' order with and gave them a £1000 deposit, next Easter I have to pay a further £4k and spec my car or cancel my order and get my deposit back.

So, surely, this will slip to next Summer but then I guess we will have the full spec.

Some of the exterior does have to change, there are a few angles, more so the side on profile that need tweaking and also they have not thought about the front number plate either.

thumb.php
 

Andyk

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61,185
It is a stunner and look forwrd to seeing her going around Llandow in 2014...
 

conaero

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***UPDATE***

If true, then this is more like it, Alfa designing and producing their own dual variable valve, efficient turbo, 4 cylinder 1.8

300hp in a car that weighs 850kg, thats 353hp per tonne!!!

To give you an idea, a Gransport has 235hp per tonne.

Alfa Romeo has released the first details of a new direct injection turbo engine under development at the FMA plant in Pratola Serra in Italy, due to launch some time in 2013.

Designed for both transverse and longitudinal applications, the new 1.8-litre four-cylinder engine offers a maximum output of 300hp, setting a new performance standard in its category, the company claims, while also ensuring compliance with future emissions standards in both Europe with Euro 6 and the US with Tier 2 Bin 5.

Constructed entirely from aluminium for a minimal weight, Alfa Romeo claims that its design incorporates the highest levels of technological innovation ever seen in an Alfa, including a 200-bar petrol direct injection system, dual variable timing, and a high-efficiency turbocharger.

According to Alfa Romeo's internal design and testing, the egine will offer a power-to-weight ratio, fuel efficiency, acoustic and vibrational comfort, and driving performance unmatched by anything else in its category.

"This is an extremely important step for Alfa Romeo, as we continue to reposition our brand and prepare it for global distribution," claimed Alfa Romeo head Harald J. Wester at the announcement. "The dedication of Group-wide resources to develop specific powertrain solutions for the specific needs of Alfa Romeo is a reflection of the renewed thrust we are placing on the development of this brand. This is a first step in a series of initiatives to be implemented in the near future which will reconnect Alfa Romeo to its historical roots as a premium Italian sports car brand."
 

conaero

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If the 4C handles well and they dont price it over £50k, then it is difficult to see how it will fail.