Brexit Deal

doodlebug · Dec 17, 2018

philw696 said:
How about this for an idea ?
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10215939098243661&id=1033229527

Link seems broken

philw696 · Dec 17, 2018

Just tried and it works.
Basically people in the Ukraine unhappy with their Politicians wait for them to leave Parliament and grab them and put them into street rubbish collection bins to show their not happy with them.

CatmanV2 · Dec 17, 2018

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C

philw696 · Dec 17, 2018

Another go then gives you the idea.

allandwf · Dec 17, 2018

philw696 said:
Another go then gives you the idea.

We'd better order more bins!

philw696 · Dec 17, 2018

MaserCoupe said:
Any Clarity on pensions etc for your situation? As there seems to be nothing concrete since triggering Article 50.. What do you suppose will now be in place for such a situation of Brits going to the E.U to live/retire over there and the existing Brits currently living over there, say in Spain/France etc. Genuine concern here as prior to Referendum it was not an issue. On a lighter note I'm still PMSL at your picture post 674.

In answer I'm really not sure but I do know that I'm welcome here so I for one are not going to worry.

Nibby · Dec 18, 2018

Navcorr said:
I share your trauma. But for very different reasons.

In the interest of brevity, and so specifically to Brexit, it is widely accepted that immigration was the key factor in the result. Yet Blair was responsible for uncontrolled numbers arriving from '04 onwards. Despite warning after warning, including from his own officials, Blair didn't impose transitional controls. As most of the rest of the EU did. Restricting access to their labour markets for 7 years. The result being immigration from the A8 countries (+Cypres & Malta) took net annual EU migration from 15K to 127K within 3 years. Yet Blair claims it was the '08 financial crash to blame. Another of his blatant lies. You may also be interesting in reading up about his dodgy deal with the Romanian Gov. ahead of their joining in '07. The result being unprecedented levels of illegal immigration.

I've been trying to avoid commenting any further on this thread. Then this. "The most sensible politician of our time". Really? You have Blair to thank for there ever being a referendum in the first place.

Hits nail on the head.

Wattie · Dec 18, 2018

Wattie said:
Ok, so to summarise the state of play.

Mays deal is hated by Brexiteers because it isn’t Brexit.
Mays deal is preferred by remainers as it isn’t Brexit but are they REALLY comfortable in being Europe’s bitches with no say......indefinitely.
Even if I was a remainer, I wouldn’t like that....we may as well join the Euro.

No-ones entirely happy.

The situation has prompted a new referendum call.....which is fine.

Remainers suggest the Q should be

Leave now (you know the price and the doomsday scenario and we’ll be lucky to survive and interest rates will go up 300% and we’ll have no food or medicines or water blah blah blah and you’ll all have to hand in your Maseratis or live in them cos you won’t be able to afford your mortgages)

Or Remain.

Brexiteers would suggest the Q should be:

Mays deal

Or “no deal”
(As the Uk voted to leave and to honour that vote)
And we take control and democracy is honoured.

What a mess.

Article 50 didn’t need to be invoked until there was a plan.

The tories invoked it without one.

Further, everyone knows Europe doesn’t negotiate “leave deals” with anyone so the Uk should have said and publicly announced from day 1 it was leaving....without a deal in all probability.

That would have given businesses 700+ days to prepare.

At the same time the Uk should have said we ain’t paying you but we will do if you approach us with a suitable proposal during this period for a deal that we agree to.

End of.

Europe rather than the Uk would be looking at 100 days for a solution. Most of Europe is bust and if you think they can stomach a no deal you’re wrong.

Oh and that would mean the Uk is only a 100 or so days away from signing all those GOODS and trade deals May said she’d been talking about at the G20..........not an ind finite period of time under her deal.

Conspiracy theorists may say that sabotage Brexit was the plan all along. Raab said today that there were options......no backstop....ignored.

Makes you wonder.

So Penny Mordaunt stated today
“we’ll discuss no deal as it’s our best chance of getting a deal”
Only taken our govt some 600 wasted days to come to that conclusion.........
The UK ain’t prepared, neither is Europe cos they think we’ll cave.
High stakes poker.......

GeoffCapes · Dec 18, 2018

I've a feeling Mrs May has been expecting this all along. She's not stupid, regardless of what others may say.
She 'agrees' a deal, which she knows the EU will love, and the UK will hate.
She knows it will never get through Parliament, so doesn't even bother.
Goes back to the EU and says, you either come up with something we like or we leave with no deal and you are all f*cked, and then the Dutch, etc all decide they'll do the same.

As my mate once said, never play poker with a woman without kids. They show no emotion.
Whether that is true or not, I don't know, but I get the sentiment.

Either that or the aim is to not leave.

jonny · Dec 18, 2018

Not meaning to be rude to anyone here, but there are many ill-informed opinions batted about: in parliament, in the media and on this forum. A referendum on something this complicated was always going to be a bit of a lottery, since you are asking people to decide on something that is inherently very difficult to understand. (And in fact made worse since both Remain and Leave campaigns were disgracefully poor at explaining anything with honesty or evidence).

If you want to be better informed (which arguably one should before one comments) then I strongly suggest reading this, the text from a lecture given by someone who truly understands how world trade and economics works. It is not a simple read - indeed most folks (me included) would need to re-read it several times to understand the implications. But it is definitely worth the effort to be better-informed on something so important.

https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/

And, once you begin to understand this analysis, it is very scary.

conaero · Dec 18, 2018

GeoffCapes said:
I've a feeling Mrs May has been expecting this all along. She's not stupid, regardless of what others may say.

Ive though this for about 6 months now.

MrMickS · Dec 18, 2018

GeoffCapes said:
I've a feeling Mrs May has been expecting this all along. She's not stupid, regardless of what others may say.

conaero said:
Ive though this for about 6 months now.

If she was that smart she wouldn't have taken the job on in the first place, it was always going to be a poison chalice. I guess it was her only chance of the top job. She tried to protect herself by putting the leave vote architects into positions to take the blame but they managed to get around that by not doing anything. She's now realised that this is her only term and she's stuffed.

D Walker · Dec 18, 2018

jonny said:
Not meaning to be rude to anyone here, but there are many ill-informed opinions batted about: in parliament, in the media and on this forum. A referendum on something this complicated was always going to be a bit of a lottery, since you are asking people to decide on something that is inherently very difficult to understand. (And in fact made worse since both Remain and Leave campaigns were disgracefully poor at explaining anything with honesty or evidence).

If you want to be better informed (which arguably one should before one comments) then I strongly suggest reading this, the text from a lecture given by someone who truly understands how world trade and economics works. It is not a simple read - indeed most folks (me included) would need to re-read it several times to understand the implications. But it is definitely worth the effort to be better-informed on something so important.

https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/

And, once you begin to understand this analysis, it is very scary.

I have read it, understood 70% I guess, which just goes to show most of us shouldn't have been asked if no one could have laid these facts in front of us in the 1st place

allandwf · Dec 18, 2018

MrMickS said:
If she was that smart she wouldn't have taken the job on in the first place, it was always going to be a poison chalice. I guess it was her only chance of the top job. She tried to protect herself by putting the leave vote architects into positions to take the blame but they managed to get around that by not doing anything. She's now realised that this is her only term and she's stuffed.

But probably live very nicely off the books, memoirs etc. on the back of it :/

Keano · Dec 18, 2018

thank you for this. interesting times ahead though i fear we have the same hand of cards to play but not the smarts to play them

GeoffCapes · Dec 18, 2018

jonny said:
Not meaning to be rude to anyone here, but there are many ill-informed opinions batted about: in parliament, in the media and on this forum. A referendum on something this complicated was always going to be a bit of a lottery, since you are asking people to decide on something that is inherently very difficult to understand. (And in fact made worse since both Remain and Leave campaigns were disgracefully poor at explaining anything with honesty or evidence).

If you want to be better informed (which arguably one should before one comments) then I strongly suggest reading this, the text from a lecture given by someone who truly understands how world trade and economics works. It is not a simple read - indeed most folks (me included) would need to re-read it several times to understand the implications. But it is definitely worth the effort to be better-informed on something so important.

https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/

And, once you begin to understand this analysis, it is very scary.

I don't know how many did any research into the pluses and minuses of Brexit, I did, and this bloke who is far cleverer than me, has hit the nail on the head.
If we do leave the EU in March, it ain't gonna be pretty.

I'm actually thinking about opening another Spreadbetting account and short everything on the UK stockmarket that exports to the EU, as their future will be very rocky indeed!

MaserCoupe · Dec 18, 2018

jonny said:
Not meaning to be rude to anyone here, but there are many ill-informed opinions batted about: in parliament, in the media and on this forum. A referendum on something this complicated was always going to be a bit of a lottery, since you are asking people to decide on something that is inherently very difficult to understand. (And in fact made worse since both Remain and Leave campaigns were disgracefully poor at explaining anything with honesty or evidence).

If you want to be better informed (which arguably one should before one comments) then I strongly suggest reading this, the text from a lecture given by someone who truly understands how world trade and economics works. It is not a simple read - indeed most folks (me included) would need to re-read it several times to understand the implications. But it is definitely worth the effort to be better-informed on something so important.

https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/

And, once you begin to understand this analysis, it is very scary.

What a real eye opener....Thank you for sharing this.

CatmanV2 · Dec 18, 2018

MaserCoupe said:
What a real eye opener....Thank you for sharing this.

Was good. It would be nice to see a piece by a similarly erudite Bexiter (should such exist, either piece or erudite Brexiter)

Because, unless one is truly not self aware, living under the belief that all those who voted 'leave' are stupid is as immediately and demonstrably disprovable as the assertion that all those who follow religion are stupid.

C

Oliver6796 · Dec 18, 2018

CatmanV2 said:
Was good. It would be nice to see a piece by a similarly erudite Bexiter (should such exist, either piece or erudite Brexiter)

Because, unless one is truly not self aware, living under the belief that all those who voted 'leave' are stupid is as immediately and demonstrably disprovable as the assertion that all those who follow religion are stupid.

C

Jesu s, don't bring religion into the thread

MaserCoupe · Dec 18, 2018

CatmanV2 said:
Was good. It would be nice to see a piece by a similarly erudite Bexiter (should such exist, either piece or erudite Brexiter)

Because, unless one is truly not self aware, living under the belief that all those who voted 'leave' are stupid is as immediately and demonstrably disprovable as the assertion that all those who follow religion are stupid.

C

Amen to that CatmanV2, Walking a mile in someone else's shoes...........

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