New F1 season - 2022

T

TimR

Member
Messages
2,731
Tallman said:
I call BS on that ;)
Click to expand...
And that...!

Wattie said:
Well Well, seems Red Bull did overspend!

apple.news

Red Bull broke the rules to win Verstappen’s title. The penalty can make or break F1’s golden era — FOX SPORTS Australia

More than 10 days of fervent speculation was finally put to rest with Red Bull’s rule-breaking confirmed. But the penalty they receive is up for debate - and it could make or break this era.
apple.news apple.news

Rules are rules- they should be thrown out of last years championship positions and Max should lose that highly disputed and controversial title.

If you can’t accurately tally up what you’re spending you’re not complying with the rules.
Apart from 1 other, everyone else managed to comply.
Click to expand...

...so;


FIFTY said:
BS end to a BS season with a BS "new" formula and BS rules that they make up as they go along.

Ciao
Click to expand...
 
Guy

Guy

Member
Messages
2,135
Wattie said:
Well Well, seems Red Bull did overspend!

apple.news

Red Bull broke the rules to win Verstappen’s title. The penalty can make or break F1’s golden era — FOX SPORTS Australia

More than 10 days of fervent speculation was finally put to rest with Red Bull’s rule-breaking confirmed. But the penalty they receive is up for debate - and it could make or break this era.
apple.news apple.news

Rules are rules- they should be thrown out of last years championship positions and Max should lose that highly disputed and controversial title.

If you can’t accurately tally up what you’re spending you’re not complying with the rules.
Apart from 1 other, everyone else managed to comply.
Click to expand...

I think Tallman nailed this;

" It’ll be interesting to see what comes out of the budget cap statement today. I don’t really see how they can enforce that in any case. Coming from a financial background, anyone can cook the books. Sponsorship deals of suppliers can value the products supplied too low. There are so many ways to defer costs, capitalise costs etc. that you will never get a clear view of what was actually spent. Obviously the spotlight will always be on the winner as the others have a vested interest to get them demoted, it’s just all fun and games and back room politics IMO. "

Williams and Aston M have/had the same issue. I am sure this will run.....
 
midlifecrisis

midlifecrisis

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16,229
Red bull are the only ones who have appeared to have overspent. Aston Martin and Williams just had filing accounts issues.

Like all championship rules, whether it's the technical regulations, Sporting Regulations or the new Financial Regulations there's always some interpretation. However, the punishment should befit the crime. Maybe less money next year? So instead of £145m they have £140m.

I have every confidence that the FIA will do the right thing....:as003:
 
Tallman

Tallman

Member
Messages
1,834
TimR said:
And that...!



...so;
Click to expand...
All the BS quoted was directed at this season not last season. This season the cars are better, we’ve seen overtaking on tracks previously not suited to overtaking, we’ve seen one driver get a big lead and that being overturned, we’ve seen some great racing. I for one enjoyed it.

Yes the FIA has not got it all right but let’s face it, all teams underwrote the new rules (Seidl of McLaren has stated that they all have egg on their face re the points fiasco of last Sunday). The same goes with the cost cap regulations. All these were agreed with everyone, including what was defined as “minor” overspend and what was “major” overspend. So the teams/principals who are now crying about that are a little disingenuous IMO. Let’s see how much the overspend was, whether it is material and what the penalty is. These are new regulations, I‘m sure there will be loopholes to be closed and corrections to be made. It’s very easy to just be critical about everything….
 
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midlifecrisis

midlifecrisis

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16,229
Tallman said:
All the BS quoted was directed at this season not last season. This season the cars are better, we’ve seen overtaking on tracks previously not suited to overtaking, we’ve seen one driver get a big lead and that being overturned, we’ve seen some great racing. I for one enjoyed it.

Yes the FIA has not got it all right but let’s face it, all teams underwrote the new rules (Seidl of McLaren has stated that they all have egg on their face re the points fiasco of last Sunday). The same goes with the cost cap regulations. All these were agreed with everyone, including what was defined as “minor” overspend and what was “major” overspend. So the teams/principals who are now crying about that are a little disingenuous IMO. Let’s see how much the overspend was, whether it is material and what the penalty is. These are new regulations, I‘m sure there will be loopholes to be closed and corrections to be made. It’s very easy to just be critical about everything….
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It's believed to be under 5% so as much as $7.25m , which according to Binotto $5m is worth half a second.

Ferrari having a decent pitstop is worth a second. I'm going to send him my invoice for that $10m worth of advice.
 
FIFTY

FIFTY

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3,100
@Tallman do you really want my musings on last year and the world's first Human Error World Champion?

Due to the pandemic delaying the "new formula" by a year 2021 was a joker card year where the rules were scrambled in order to take the inherent strengths away from MB's package to facilitate success for another team - or at least level the playing field. The rule makers did not want another MB championship as they felt it was making their sport stale but instead it has turned it into a bit of a Muppet show as it is continually spiralling.
 
Tallman

Tallman

Member
Messages
1,834
FIFTY said:
@Tallman do you really want my musings on last year and the world's first Human Error World Champion?

Due to the pandemic delaying the "new formula" by a year 2021 was a joker card year where the rules were scrambled in order to take the inherent strengths away from MB's package to facilitate success for another team - or at least level the playing field. The rule makers did not want another MB championship as they felt it was making their sport stale but instead it has turned it into a bit of a Muppet show as it is continually spiralling.
Click to expand...
Nah, been there done that, I rather look forward ;)
 
Wattie

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
Guy said:
I think Tallman nailed this;

" It’ll be interesting to see what comes out of the budget cap statement today. I don’t really see how they can enforce that in any case. Coming from a financial background, anyone can cook the books. Sponsorship deals of suppliers can value the products supplied too low. There are so many ways to defer costs, capitalise costs etc. that you will never get a clear view of what was actually spent. Obviously the spotlight will always be on the winner as the others have a vested interest to get them demoted, it’s just all fun and games and back room politics IMO. "

Williams and Aston M have/had the same issue. I am sure this will run.....
Click to expand...
Disagree.

“Sorry officer, yup I’m a bit pis5ed but hey I’d like to refer you to the Red Bull precedent and as Im within 5% of the “limit” I’ll be on my way,
Good day”.

(Diego only used 5% of his arm when he punched that ball in ie his fingers tips- so stop whining about it)

The time they gained from overspend gave them a material advantage over the season.

Playing beyond the rules is cheating.
 
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D Walker

D Walker

Member
Messages
9,827
Wattie said:
Disagree.

“Sorry officer, yup I’m a bit pis5ed but hey I’d like to refer you to the Red Bull precedent and as Im within 5% of the “limit” I’ll be on my way,
Good day”.

(Diego only used 5% of his arm when he punched that ball in ie his fingers tips- so stop whining about it)

The time they gained from overspend gave them a material advantage over the season.

Playing beyond the rules is cheating.
Click to expand...
Agreed. Otherwise everyone would have overspent.
 
Phil H

Phil H

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Messages
4,167
D Walker said:
Agreed. Otherwise everyone would have overspent.
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The notion of a spending cap is understandable but I'd be most surprised if the top F1 teams didn't use some very creative accountants; that 5% will already be factored in to the spend, so the true figure could be much higher.
 
Jamin

Jamin

Member
Messages
238
midlifecrisis said:
Red bull are the only ones who have appeared to have overspent. Aston Martin and Williams just had filing accounts issues.

Like all championship rules, whether it's the technical regulations, Sporting Regulations or the new Financial Regulations there's always some interpretation. However, the punishment should befit the crime. Maybe less money next year? So instead of £145m they have £140m.

I have every confidence that the FIA will do the right thing....:as003:
Click to expand...
I bet they won't reverse the decision and strip red bulls title,
a fine for spending too much money won't hurt either so as Midlifecrisis said reduce the budget for this year by double the overspend so 10% off with rollover into next year too.
The reality though will be the mechanics have to bring in their own sandwiches and sleep in the lorry
 
Wattie

Wattie

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Messages
8,640
Jamin said:
I bet they won't reverse the decision and strip red bulls title,
a fine for spending too much money won't hurt either so as Midlifecrisis said reduce the budget for this year by double the overspend so 10% off with rollover into next year too.
The reality though will be the mechanics have to bring in their own sandwiches and sleep in the lorry
Click to expand...
Well that would just sum up todays values.
Cheat….forgiven.

No moral hazard.

Bit like bankers who know they’ll get fined less than the profits they made for manipulation.

Society is worse off.

Draw a line in the sand- in sport at least!
 
philw696

philw696

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Messages
25,469
What a World that many think that Cheating was acceptable.
We were taught at school it wasn't and when I once thought it clever too I got the cane in the days when they felt they could hurt you and it did.
 
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