Formula 1 Qualifying F1

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TimR

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Left hand doesnt seem to know what the right hand is doing...!
Someone said its over regulated. Its hard to see how, when what they present is a case of "Sorry- I havent a clue"....:confused:
Arent the upcoming races all on tracks hitherto unraced by F1. It doesnt bestow an automatic excitement or anticipation...but its an unknowm quantity , at least for the first couple of laps of FP1.
Sorry...as exciting as they all want us to find it- I thought the race rather dull !

( ps- feck the apostrophe..! )
 
Oneball

Oneball

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P R said:
I think I'd rather be in Hamiltons position than Max's at the minute. Despite the slender points lead Max has the Merc is so much quicker. Added to that the Saudi track is a power track its in Mercs hands now

As for Horner (or any of them for that matter).. they all appear nice guys until the going gets tough! That said the circumstances of the waved yellow must have p*ssed them off (including Bottas).. the graphic said track clear, the steering wheel warning lights did not show the yellows, nor the track side warning lights. It was the one marshall that waved the flags
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Shouldn’t have ****** them off, what they should have done was given their drivers a bollocking.

The flag system starts with the marshal, all the other things you mention are secondary systems, if there’s a marshal waving a flag you must slow down and in the case of double waved be prepared to stop. They all know this, most have grown up with the flag system since karting as kids.

Everyone misses a flag every now and again, we’ve all done it, but the fact that so many of them did it is because they’ve been getting away with it too often recently.
 
Andyk

Andyk

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61,329
I for one hope Lewis wins this year as that will give him the title of most successful F1 driver of all time and as a British driver that’s what we need. Now after that I really don’t mind who wins.
 
Tallman

Tallman

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I think he’s won enough, time for some new blood. Hamilton already has the most poles and wins, surely he doesn’t need more. Mind you he’s been lucky to get to this point this season - whenever he had a problem or penalties it hasn’t cost him. Verstappen has led by far the most laps so I think he deserves it (more). The sudden speed increase and subsequent checking of the rear wing and introducing more back wing tests shows that Mercedes was at best making unintended use of the regulations. Ok now the Hamilton fans can come butcher me.
 
zagatoes30

zagatoes30

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Max and Lewis are in a different league, without them things are much closer maybe they should be handed a season ban for both being annoying !!

Good race and if it continues all results could go down to the wire.
 
Oneball

Oneball

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The wing stuff is smoke and mirrors from Red Bull at no point have Mercedes had the fastest top speeds recently and at Brazil Max’s car was the slowest down the back straight of every single car on track. Yuki Tsunoda was 15kph faster than him without DRS! They’re just jealous they’ve not managed to keep up with car development.

You could argue that Mercedes have been penalised more than RB as they’ve had to make technical changes to the car.

Your point about laps led would be my argument why he doesn’t deserve to be world champion. Too many mistakes. If Red Bull had been harder on him in the past and conditioned him to make sensible choices he’d be miles ahead by now and Mercedes late season surge wouldn’t have mattered. It’s Hamilton’s strength in my opinion, he almost always makes the right decision for the championship. Except against Rosberg, that season flustered him, I wonder if the same would have happened to Max had Ricciardo stayed.

But if it is going down to the wire it must be a pretty fair fight irrespective of the stuff that they all put out at press conferences.
 
P R

P R

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Oneball said:
The wing stuff is smoke and mirrors from Red Bull at no point have Mercedes had the fastest top speeds recently and at Brazil Max’s car was the slowest down the back straight of every single car on track. Yuki Tsunoda was 15kph faster than him without DRS! They’re just jealous they’ve not managed to keep up with car development.

You could argue that Mercedes have been penalised more than RB as they’ve had to make technical changes to the car.

Your point about laps led would be my argument why he doesn’t deserve to be world champion. Too many mistakes. If Red Bull had been harder on him in the past and conditioned him to make sensible choices he’d be miles ahead by now and Mercedes late season surge wouldn’t have mattered. It’s Hamilton’s strength in my opinion, he almost always makes the right decision for the championship. Except against Rosberg, that season flustered him, I wonder if the same would have happened to Max had Ricciardo stayed.

But if it is going down to the wire it must be a pretty fair fight irrespective of the stuff that they all put out at press conferences.
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I thought they were very limited on engine and aero developments through a season, have merc kept their tokens for now? (genuine question there, Im not sure)

And I think Max would have a sack ful more points had he not been nerfed off the track twice (Silverstone and Hungary)
 
Tallman

Tallman

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Oneball said:
The wing stuff is smoke and mirrors from Red Bull at no point have Mercedes had the fastest top speeds recently and at Brazil Max’s car was the slowest down the back straight of every single car on track. Yuki Tsunoda was 15kph faster than him without DRS! They’re just jealous they’ve not managed to keep up with car development.

You could argue that Mercedes have been penalised more than RB as they’ve had to make technical changes to the car.

Your point about laps led would be my argument why he doesn’t deserve to be world champion. Too many mistakes. If Red Bull had been harder on him in the past and conditioned him to make sensible choices he’d be miles ahead by now and Mercedes late season surge wouldn’t have mattered. It’s Hamilton’s strength in my opinion, he almost always makes the right decision for the championship. Except against Rosberg, that season flustered him, I wonder if the same would have happened to Max had Ricciardo stayed.

But if it is going down to the wire it must be a pretty fair fight irrespective of the stuff that they all put out at press conferences.
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Lets just stick to the facts rather than turning arguments around.

Max has won 9 times and had 7 2nd places. He has 3 DNF's, one caused by a tyre failure, and 2 through crashes with Hamilton, of which each got the blame for one of them. Note that when Hamilton got the blame for the crash he still won so him crashing into Max gained him 25 points. So much for comments about Max taking his opponent out. Max has one other bad result (9th) in Hungary where Bottas crashed in to him without fault. I'm not sure where you see the mistakes but I'm open to hear.

Then Hamilton: 7 wins but not as many DNF's. On some of those wins he had help from Bottas (Max has had very little help from Perez until the last few races). Those times that Hamilton didn't come second either he or Mercedes made mistakes. In Azerebeijan, he botched the re-start and ended pointless. He has had a number of other off's where he was saved by the red flag so he could repair his car and get new tyres. For example Emilia Romagna, where Hamilton made a mistake, hitting the wall and damaging his front wing. After approximately a minute in the gravel, he rejoined and then the red flag came out rescuing him - he went on to finish second. So that was because of other incidents, no strategy calls or driving skills. At the Portuguese GP Hamilton won after "overtaking" Bottas. When Hamilton had a puncture he still had enough functionality to win - Max had a blow-out and went into the wall. In Turkey he could have been higher up if the pit stop strategy had been better with Martin Brundle noting that Hamilton should take responsibility for his initial pit strategy saying he should have respected the initial instructions to pit. Max has also overtaken Hamilton a few times at the start (more than the other way around).

As to top speeds: In the Sprint race, where Hamilton came from the back of the grid, his top speed was 339 km/h. Max was 22 km/h slower so I'm not sure where you get your stats from? Smoke and mirrors on your side perhaps ;) I don't know how Hamilton could have overtaken so many cars on the straight if he didn't have a faster car.

So I'm not sure how you could argue that Hamilton deserves it more based on this season's results. Now if you said you don't like Max and you prefer Hamilton (or you prefer a British driver) to win, that I could accept. Surely not coloured glasses? ;)
 
Andyk

Andyk

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61,329
Tallman said:
I think he’s won enough, time for some new blood. Hamilton already has the most poles and wins, surely he doesn’t need more. Mind you he’s been lucky to get to this point this season - whenever he had a problem or penalties it hasn’t cost him. Verstappen has led by far the most laps so I think he deserves it (more). The sudden speed increase and subsequent checking of the rear wing and introducing more back wing tests shows that Mercedes was at best making unintended use of the regulations. Ok now the Hamilton fans can come butcher me.
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No …. he needs to win another as said we need a British record breaker and to have the most successful driver of all time from the UK is fantastic…I am an F1 one fan and have my favourite drivers but I wouldn’t say I am an out and out Lewis fan and would prefer to see Lando or Russel start to win but only after Lewis has achieved this goal.
 
Oneball

Oneball

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Tallman said:
Lets just stick to the facts rather than turning arguments around.

Max has won 9 times and had 7 2nd places. He has 3 DNF's, one caused by a tyre failure, and 2 through crashes with Hamilton, of which each got the blame for one of them. Note that when Hamilton got the blame for the crash he still won so him crashing into Max gained him 25 points. So much for comments about Max taking his opponent out. Max has one other bad result (9th) in Hungary where Bottas crashed in to him without fault. I'm not sure where you see the mistakes but I'm open to hear.

Then Hamilton: 7 wins but not as many DNF's. On some of those wins he had help from Bottas (Max has had very little help from Perez until the last few races). Those times that Hamilton didn't come second either he or Mercedes made mistakes. In Azerebeijan, he botched the re-start and ended pointless. He has had a number of other off's where he was saved by the red flag so he could repair his car and get new tyres. For example Emilia Romagna, where Hamilton made a mistake, hitting the wall and damaging his front wing. After approximately a minute in the gravel, he rejoined and then the red flag came out rescuing him - he went on to finish second. So that was because of other incidents, no strategy calls or driving skills. At the Portuguese GP Hamilton won after "overtaking" Bottas. When Hamilton had a puncture he still had enough functionality to win - Max had a blow-out and went into the wall. In Turkey he could have been higher up if the pit stop strategy had been better with Martin Brundle noting that Hamilton should take responsibility for his initial pit strategy saying he should have respected the initial instructions to pit. Max has also overtaken Hamilton a few times at the start (more than the other way around).

As to top speeds: In the Sprint race, where Hamilton came from the back of the grid, his top speed was 339 km/h. Max was 22 km/h slower so I'm not sure where you get your stats from? Smoke and mirrors on your side perhaps ;) I don't know how Hamilton could have overtaken so many cars on the straight if he didn't have a faster car.

So I'm not sure how you could argue that Hamilton deserves it more based on this season's results. Now if you said you don't like Max and you prefer Hamilton (or you prefer a British driver) to win, that I could accept. Surely not coloured glasses? ;)
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DRS is the reason why cars seem so much faster when watching on the TV, I’ve never liked it, it’s a bodge to get round something that should be controlled by tech regs, and gives an unfair advantage especially to the top teams. Without DRS Hamilton wouldn’t have got that far in the sprint race.

In terms of facts below is speeds from the sprint race.

Fastest speeds are Norris and Kimi and at the speed trap on the back straight Yuki is 11kph faster than Max so I rounded a bit but pretty sure that’s what it says below. I never said Max wasn’t slower but saying the Merc must be cheating because they’re faster than the Red Bull means that 3/4 of the grid are cheating too.


93610
People have short memories it was only last year that Perez went from last to first. It doesn’t mean they’ve all of a sudden changed the car and are now cheating. It does happen.
 
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Tallman

Tallman

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Andyk said:
No …. he needs to win another as said we need a British record breaker and to have the most successful driver of all time from the UK is fantastic…I am an F1 one fan and have my favourite drivers but I wouldn’t say I am an out and out Lewis fan and would prefer to see Lando or Russel start to win but only after Lewis has achieved this goal.
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Didn't realise you were using the royal "we" ;)
 
Oneball

Oneball

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11,130
P R said:
I thought they were very limited on engine and aero developments through a season, have merc kept their tokens for now? (genuine question there, Im not sure)

And I think Max would have a sack ful more points had he not been nerfed off the track twice (Silverstone and Hungary)
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Don’t know, but suspension geo, dampers, spring rates, aero settings are all part of development and although you can bung figures into a computer they’re no substitute for on track development and with the limited pre season testing a lot of that has now moved to race weekends.
 
Tallman

Tallman

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So now if I were Toto I would do the following:

Given that Saudi Arabia has a lot of straights so beneficial to the extra speed of the Mercedes, I would get Bottas a new engine for a 5 place grid drop. Most probably he will recover but even if he doesn’t get ahead of Max, presuming Max would be in second behind Hamilton with his Brazil fast engine, he would have a fast engine for Abu Dhabi and so could hold off Max if push came to shove.

If I were Horner, I would think that one win should be enough and the best chance for that is Abu Dhabi. So give Max a new engine in Saudi, hopefully recover to 3rd or 4th place and be about 3 to 6 points behind Hamilton. Then if he wins Abu Dhabi he wins the championship. If he doesn’t, he would have lost the championship anyway.
 
Oneball

Oneball

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A journalist will ask Max another question, Max will headbutt him and get a one race ban.

Hamilton will put it on pole. Marko will request a review of how Hamilton was 1/100 quicker than everyone else. (Horner will be elsewhere) The FIA will devise a new test involving Todt jumping on the rear wing but the Merc will pass anyway.

Hamilton will storm into an unassailable lead only to be given a black flag by a rogue marshal called Christian who promised he’d help out after saying naughty things about race officials.

Both MV and LH will therefore score 0 and it’ll be on to Abu Dhabi
 
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