Energy crisis

[GeoffCapes]

So no income but still have overheads, a building at least minimally heat, pay rates and staff to retain. Good business sense...not. Just close a few floors/rooms. They need a decent energy advise.

When people can't afford stuff the first thing the think of is to shut down. Plant rooms will go back to lockdown settings. The'll use a fraction of the normal energy, staff will go, 2 people ran 300 room hotels in lockdown.
The same will happen again.

I have a client who previously had a 600k per year energy bill for 2 hotel.
Yesterday they were quoted 2m for a 6 month contract.

So effectively they have to make 3.4m profit to get back to last years figures. And then start again.

 

[TimR]

 

[D Walker]

In fairness I originally thought our current tariff was a rip-off. Our previous fix ended just after the September 21 price increases and everything went crazy. I think that was around the time of the electric mains fire in Folkestone causing supply issues?

In hindsight our tariff now looks amazing, so it’s all relative - right?

Fixed ours Nov 21 I think....not sure on rates...

 

[midlifecrisis]

When people can't afford stuff the first thing the think of is to shut down. Plant rooms will go back to lockdown settings. The'll use a fraction of the normal energy, staff will go, 2 people ran 300 room hotels in lockdown.
The same will happen again.

I have a client who previously had a 600k per year energy bill for 2 hotel.
Yesterday they were quoted 2m for a 6 month contract.

So effectively they have to make 3.4m profit to get back to last years figures. And then start again.

But the audience wasn't there as we were in lockdown, only a few people could stay in a hotel for work purposes. We're out of lockdown now and poeple will choose to go elsewhere permanently. Might as well close the business, shareholders wouldn't be impressed.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Meanwhile another 1320MW possible via Hornsea 2 got turned on today.

Just need the wind to blow...

 

[Felonious Crud]

Meanwhile another 1320MW possible via Hornsea 2 got turned on today.

Just need the wind to blow...

Hot air any use? If only this forum could be weaponised...

 

[jasst]

Oi! ^^ @Wattie & @GeoffCapes. FFS.

cooler cooler cooler

 

[Felonious Crud]

cooler cooler cooler

There's some background work to make it much easier to chuck filthy miscreants in the cooler. Until then, short-term bans are the only remedy for those that deviate.

 

[Wattie]

[

cooler cooler cooler

Unfortunately it’s becoming too expensive to chill the cooler.
It will need to be renamed to “ambient”.

 

[Sam McGoo]

Oi! ^^ @Wattie & @GeoffCapes. FFS.

To be fair, I think the varied opinions on this forum, are what make it. And its a good source of information that I probably wouldn't go searching for otherwise. You don't have to read them.
It's also completely relevant to the title of the thread. lol


Anyway, I'm following the whole thread with interest as I'm in a fairly old/energy thirsty house. With oil central Heating, LPG hobs and Electric everything else.
We had a new Oil boiler fitted about 4 years ago, after the 25 year old one finally completely died, and it has helped the oil consumption substantially. Its just a shame Kerosene is 3x the cost now, so probably still worse off. (Don't hear the news/martin Lewis trying to get help for us oil burners).
I did have a look at Air and ground source at the time, but we would have had to increase our radiator size/amount significantly or dig up all our floors and fit underfloor heating. Both of which not desirable.
Better wall insulation would make a big difference, but we will do that as and when we re-decorate each room.

Electric-wise, after the first winter electricity bill (it was large) we had there 9 years ago, was to replace the 112 x 55w downlighters for LED, along with the 40 and 60w lamps and all the dusk-dawn outside lights etc which was a big outlay back then, but made a massive difference.
There are still loads of things we could do, like actually switching off unnecessary appliances, TVs, amps etc etc. and I think we will have to start doing that.

I didn't ever want to put solar panels on the old welsh slate house roof, so have always disregarded it. But we will soon be building an oak cart lodge, which obviously needs a roof, so wondering if it'd be a good opportunity to get some Solar panels on there, or maybe on my Garage roof.

Watching this thread with interest.

 

[dickygrace]

Ground source heat pumps are dear, my sister had one installed when extending her house. Said it was about £120k which was staggering to me, and it would take 12-15 years to break even. I thought I’d rather swallow the utility bills and have a couple of nice cars instead. Turns out 5 years down the line, it’ll have paid for itself a lot sooner than planned, possibly in 2-3 years from now.

 

[Ewan]

It's been reports in all the hospitality trade newsletters I get.

I number of hotels are shutting on 1st October until 1st April so they don't have to pay the huge energy prices.

My lovely local pub (with 8 bedrooms, so a mini-hotel) closed this week, apparently because of the cost of energy. Such a shame. Took Dicky G for lunch there a few years back.

 

[philw696]

It's sad to see things like that happen Ewan as a big part of our culture.
Once gone hard to bring back and certainly brave for any investor to do.

 

[Ewan]

Apparently the utility bill had risen to £59k per year. The cost of food + beer had also risen to levels the owner felt couldn’t be passed on to the customers. I imagine this will be the case for lots of other pubs as well.

 

[Felonious Crud]

To be fair, I think the varied opinions on this forum, are what make it. And its a good source of information that I probably wouldn't go searching for otherwise. You don't have to read them.
It's also completely relevant to the title of the thread. lol


Anyway, I'm following the whole thread with interest as I'm in a fairly old/energy thirsty house. With oil central Heating, LPG hobs and Electric everything else.
We had a new Oil boiler fitted about 4 years ago, after the 25 year old one finally completely died, and it has helped the oil consumption substantially. Its just a shame Kerosene is 3x the cost now, so probably still worse off. (Don't hear the news/martin Lewis trying to get help for us oil burners).
I did have a look at Air and ground source at the time, but we would have had to increase our radiator size/amount significantly or dig up all our floors and fit underfloor heating. Both of which not desirable.
Better wall insulation would make a big difference, but we will do that as and when we re-decorate each room.

Electric-wise, after the first winter electricity bill (it was large) we had there 9 years ago, was to replace the 112 x 55w downlighters for LED, along with the 40 and 60w lamps and all the dusk-dawn outside lights etc which was a big outlay back then, but made a massive difference.
There are still loads of things we could do, like actually switching off unnecessary appliances, TVs, amps etc etc. and I think we will have to start doing that.

I didn't ever want to put solar panels on the old welsh slate house roof, so have always disregarded it. But we will soon be building an oak cart lodge, which obviously needs a roof, so wondering if it'd be a good opportunity to get some Solar panels on there, or maybe on my Garage roof.

Watching this thread with interest.

Discussion of how to save energy is good, but prophesies of global doom and dragging China/Russia/politics into the debate descends fast into wider, thornier discussion and is not welcomed.

Like you, I have an old creaky, leaky house so there are some good pointers on here that are valuable to know (literally). Right now I'm identifying old appliances which consume way too much electricity. So far the suspected culprits have been pretty light consumers, but the old freezer has its cards marked. Not the cooler for that, but an outright ban.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Ground source heat pumps are dear, my sister had one installed when extending her house. Said it was about £120k which was staggering to me, and it would take 12-15 years to break even. I thought I’d rather swallow the utility bills and have a couple of nice cars instead. Turns out 5 years down the line, it’ll have paid for itself a lot sooner than planned, possibly in 2-3 years from now.

Jeez, that's expensive. A friend was quoted £60k which is still prohibitively expensive. My ASHP was a fraction of this.
I reckon most of the cost is the plant and time to dig in the pipework.
Also it depends on what you're trying heat. A well lagged 3 bed semi or a draughty mansion.

 

[dickygrace]

Jeez, that's expensive. A friend was quoted £60k which is still prohibitively expensive. My ASHP was a fraction of this.
I reckon most of the cost is the plant and time to dig in the pipework.
Also it depends on what you're trying heat. A well lagged 3 bed semi or a draughty mansion.

Yes she’s got a very nice old country house in N Yorkshire so it’ll have been a pretty high spec piece of kit I’d have thought.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Discussion of how to save energy is good, but prophesies of global doom and dragging China/Russia/politics into the debate descends fast into wider, thornier discussion and is not welcomed.

Like you, I have an old creaky, leaky house so there are some good pointers on here that are valuable to know (literally). Right now I'm identifying old appliances which consume way too much electricity. So far the suspected culprits have been pretty light consumers, but the old freezer has its cards marked. Not the cooler for that, but an outright ban.

Once you've banished the energy wasters, I would attack the leaks and then insulate. And the reduce the temperature of your old boiler...

 

[midlifecrisis]

Yes she’s got a very nice old country house in N Yorkshire so it’ll have been a pretty high spec piece of kit I’d have thought.

I'm not doubting the quality of the kit, nor the expertise of the installer or surveyor specifying the equipment required (so very important!) .

It's just that some older houses are being 'found out' as to how inefficient they are retaining heat. I expect the National Trust to get their begging bowl out soon. So pop in to Tatton Park before it shuts for winter.

 

[Felonious Crud]

Once you've banished the energy wasters, I would attack the leaks and then insulate. And the reduce the temperature of your old boiler...

The boiler's new, we're kind of ok insulated in the attic and all windows are double-glazed. There are a couple of old doors that don't fit too well, but the upside of the gentle draft is that it does at least encourage ventilation and help reduce damp.

Woolly jumpers and thick socks for everyone!