Ticking under load?

[ferrarireddino]

Hi hoping someone on this forum has some suggestions...

My 90th anniversary spyder which I bought in July has been with a main dealer for some work since then.... great lead times for parts from Italy...

The car has been off the road since 2012 bar a couple of short spins between storage facilities, total 17K miles on car before being taken off the road.

Work completed by main dealer = new spigot bearing, flywheel, clutch, throw out, new rear suspension lower arms, drop links, oil (10w 60), water, new instrument binnacle, obviously exhaust system has been off for the work above. Various other bits n bobs like sorting roof mechanism (sensor position issue, faulty motor).. nothing major.

There was a ticking sound when started from cold (not the variator issue) and this was there when I saw the car 12 months ago and started it first it, sounded like the usual oil drained from tappets over time, the noise subsides after a couple of mins running as engine warms up and oil flows through heads and clears out air pockets under tappits etc. They aren't concerned about that nor am I - probably a NRV needs replacing... and fact car not been driven in such a long time....

There is one thing that they cannot understand, yet at least..... low level ticking when engine under load at 1200 rpm (as in when you try to stall), and at about 3,000 RPM under load. Don't believe related to the tappits. Not a loud noise, but its there...

They continue their investigations, noise is less today than when they drove the car for first time yesterday, but very few miles on the car since all of the above done.

They propose to check no leakage in exhaust system on ramp tomorrow, and will try and replicate loading by putting from underneath with a lever arm on engine.

Wondering has anyone experienced something like this before on a 4200/ GS - this is a dry sump model.

If the under car checks don't find anything, they propose to drive the car for a couple of days put a few more miles on it, and then probably do an oil change to rule out sludge, metal on metal etc.

Personally I doubt its internal to engine had a good listen to it when I considered buying initially, pressure and leak down done on engine all good.

Any insights appreciated...

Cheers

Tom

 

[conaero]

If it's rpm related I would say it's something in the aux belt, ac pump/alternator or noisy idlers.

Remove the aux belt and run the engine to see if it disappears.

 

[ferrarireddino]

If it's rpm related I would say it's something in the aux belt, ac pump/alternator or noisy idlers.

Remove the aux belt and run the engine to see if it disappears.

Interesting.... Thx... Do these cars by any chance suffer from the static discharge issue u can get on some Ferraris from the aux belts... Sounds like a ticking...

 

[Gp79]

Check one of the spark plugs has not come loose, had a very loose one on mine.

I have heard this can cause an expensive sounding ticking noise, but only needs them nipping up to cure.

 

[conaero]

Could be a coil pack on its way out, under load will increase the stress and there could be some arching.

 

[ferrarireddino]

Dealer has located the noise as top end cylinder 8... Not there permanently just at certain revs and intermittent.

Car passed compression and leak down test with flying colours before I bought.... Thankfully!

They are going down the liquid moly additive route first for the sticky tappit solution.

I asked for 10w 60 instead of standard grade based on various forums... Just wondering with hindsight ... For a car that has been sitting for so long was this right or should I have gone with standard oil?

Assuming this is crud or sticky tappit due to crud - I have heard of others taking 1-2 litres of oil out and replacing with same grade diesel oil - running at temp for 15 mins and then draining - due to much higher deterrent properties of diesel oil.

Any one got a view on this?

Worst case I'm guessing it's either partially blocked oil way to tappit or worn tappit ... Interested if anyone has seen this before on cylinder 8 ( or others for that matter?)

Cheers

 

[conaero]

Swap the coil pack to cylinder 1 and see if the issue follows the coil pack.

The coils can make a clicking noise when they start to break down.

 

[ferrarireddino]

Cheers will let them know....

 

[ferrarireddino]

Spoke to main dealer senior tech is 17 a year Ferrari and Maserati veteran (worked on my 360 before - very good guy).... He cannot tie down the noise other than it appears to be 5-8 bank, appears to be around cylinder 8, top end.

He is going to take the cam cover off and have a look inside to see if anything obvious emerges, might even remove exhaust cam to check tappits. Advised him to replace the NRV for oil into the head and on the variator while in there.

Says he has tried under the car, all over the engine, but cannot consistently repeat the noise, He thought it might be exhaust system related but nothing obvious, ruled out the aux belts and attachments, coils etc. He cannot find the source with the car on a hoist in the garage. He has taken the car for 2 days on his commute to/ from work - the car is running perfectly, very strong engine, perfectly smooth, no lumpy idle, no codes to indicate misfire in any cylinder (spring/ burnt vale etc.), no bearing noise of any kind, no variator noise, doesn't think its drive train related.

It only appears very intermittently while driving car under load...with no obvious pattern to it (which is ironically reassuring!)

His advice at this stage is if nothing found as a result of this, in all probability its something rattling in exterior of engine bay some place that is impossible to tie down easily when the car is not in motion with combined road and engine vibration.

Anyone got any thoughts?, my view is if nothing found with this effort..... just drive the car....and wait for a bit to fall off or out of some cavity

 

[philw696]

From my experience and a lot of time has already been spent you have to let it develop and monitor from now on.

 

[ferrarireddino]

From my experience and a lot of time has already been spent you have to let it develop and monitor from now on.

inclined to agree with you. Cam cover off showed nothing at all - so at least its nothing internal to the engine.

They drained the oil/ broke the filter open to check for crud and any metal - nothing found

Tech suggested one final check based on feedback from Modena, didn't get the full details - apparently on early GS / anniversary models there is some oil feed pipe that can have some form of breakdown on the internal of the pipe, which can result something that's sounds like a ticking at specific oil flow speeds as internal of the pipe vibrates - apparently there is a test for it - so that will be the very last thing he checks.

If that shows nothing it can't be anything significant..... time to enjoy the car!!

 

[tomoshea]

Just an update guys.... turned out my ticking noise was exhaust header related...

The issue is the inner header lining was tapping off the outer header lining.

A quick and small weld for each header entrance skins has resulted in the noise disaperaing completely....

 

[Gp79]

That's good news.

Do you have any photo of the repair?

I take it manifolds off and inner skins drilled then welded to the outer sections?

 

[tomoshea]

No photos unfortunately, done by main dealer- appears the original spot welds just broke.... job done properly this time..Hopefully