Meanwhile. On the Ukrainian border.

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whereskeith

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This situation is completely the fault of the USA and NATO,… NATO has consistently moved forces and missiles closer and closer to Russian borders, then expects no push back.
Imagine if Russia and China started war drills just off the American coast and putting missiles and troops in Mexico and Canada , that’s exactly what’s happening.
 

Oneball

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This situation is completely the fault of the USA and NATO,… NATO has consistently moved forces and missiles closer and closer to Russian borders, then expects no push back.
Imagine if Russia and China started war drills just off the American coast and putting missiles and troops in Mexico and Canada , that’s exactly what’s happening.

I’m not convinced, all our tanks are now in the UK, do we have any offensive presence at all in Europe?

Or do you mean that former Soviet Bloc countries have joined NATO?

Same goes for China?

(interested, not being argumentative)
 

whereskeith

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yes , lots of former Soviet bloc countries have joined NATO , Nato doesn’t need them as part of alliance so why let them in? They don’t really contribute anything apart from a forward land base.
my understanding was when the Berlin wall came down NATO agreed not to move further east .

The USA likes/needs an enemy of considerable threat to maintain fear to maintain arms sales .

Do we actually have any tanks ? :)

I’m not convinced, all our tanks are now in the UK, do we have any offensive presence at all in Europe?

Or do you mean that former Soviet Bloc countries have joined NATO?

Same goes for China?

(interested, not being argumentative)
 
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The darker areas of the map are areas with a greater number of the population who claim Russian as their native /
first language.

Putin is known to want a land corridor to solidify his hold on Crimea. The deep brown land mass farthest south.
Which is also headquarters of the Russian Black Sea Fleet.

So, his pretext to invade is to protect the 'minority' Russian speaking people in the south east of the country.

Allegedly Biden misspoke yesterday when he said publicly what had been agreed in private, between Russia and
the US. That a limited campaign to achieve the above would be accepted by the U.S. I doubt that he did misspeak.
Given his lifetime as a politician. I believe he was sending up 'a balloon' to prepare the US people (and others)
for what is to come.

Putin is very conscious of his diminishing popularity at home. A short war would increase his popularity.

I suspect that the US and Russians have done a deal. Russia gets its land corridor in the Ukraine.
At an unspecified later date. The Ukraine will formally apply and be accepted into NATO.
Biden will pressure the Ukrainians into accepting the US / Russia deal as a fait accompli. Possibly in return
for EU and NATO membership at a later date.

Risks. The Ukrainians go 'off the reservation' and dig in for a protracted guerrilla campaign. However, the
topography of the eastern part of the country precludes this. Its similar to the Fulda Gap in Germany, where
the West always assumed that Russian armour and mechanised infantry divisions would attack, cutting the country
in half and be impossible to stop without using tactical nuclear weapons.

Allegedly the Ukrainians returned all the nuclear weapons that were left on their soil, after the collapse of the
Soviet Union. I believe this to be true. However it is a 'wild card'. Though one which I'm guessing that the
Americans have neutralised.

Bottom line. This is still NATO acquiescing to a land grab, by force by Russia. Of territory within a country friendly
to the West. If not actually a member of the EU or NATO as yet.
As others have said. Real politik is at play. And we have a lot to be thankful for. That we aren't Ukrainians living in
what will shortly be part of Russia. However, will this satisfy Putin's desire to 'straighten his front'?
Only time will tell.
 

Oneball

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yes , lots of former Soviet bloc countries have joined NATO , Nato doesn’t need them as part of alliance so why let them in? They don’t really contribute anything apart from a forward land base.
my understanding was when the Berlin wall came down NATO agreed not to move further east .

The USA likes/needs an enemy of considerable threat to maintain fear to maintain arms sales .

Do we actually have any tanks ? :)

I think they came into NATO because Putin scared the **** out of them, either that or a nice office with Belgian beer.

Yep, Challenger 3 will be coming into service soon.
 
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Do we actually have any tanks ? :)
We have several hundred. However, they are at least two decades out of date and the Commons Audit Committee or Select Defence Committee has in a report this month, categorised them as completely unfit for purpose.
Our armoured personnel carriers, Warrior, was a superb bit of kit, once the kinks were ironed out.
That was also two decades ago. It is also obsolete.
Everything else is either 60's or 70's vintage, the FV Series and is laughably out of date. Or else, was designed
for insurgent warfare in Afghanistan and completely useless against a mechanised army, like Russia.
In short. Our military procurement process is completely Fubar and has been for decades.
Even attack helicopters, ground attack aircraft and artillery is also insufficient to deploy in more than
the strength of a couple of weak brigades and these are useless when not used in a coalition like NATO.
Assuming all NATO members provide effective mechanised armour and infantry. Doubtful.

Challenger 3 is an upgrade of the current platform. Not a new tank. It will still be obsolete against an enemy like the Russians and is only designed as a stop gap until we procure an entirely new tank. Contracts for the Challenger upgrade have only just been signed. So, its completion is years away.

To make matters worse. We have a tiny capacity to actually 'lift' forces close to a battle zone. We're almost
completely dependent on the US for 'lift'. Even when we had substantial forces in Germany, this was a massive
problem. Lately we've started to preposition tanks and other heavy equipment back in Germany. But, the process
has hardly started, as far as I know.
 
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D Walker

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We have several hundred. However, they are at least two decades out of date and the Commons Audit Committee or Select Defence Committee has in a report this month, categorised them as completely unfit for purpose.
Our armoured personnel carriers, Warrior, was a superb bit of kit, once the kinks were ironed out.
That was also two decades ago. It is also obsolete.
Everything else is either 60's or 70's vintage, the FV Series and is laughably out of date. Or else, was designed
for insurgent warfare in Afghanistan and completely useless against a mechanised army, like Russia.
In short. Our military procurement process is completely Fubar and has been for decades.
Even attack helicopters, ground attack aircraft and artillery is also insufficient to deploy in more than
the strength of a couple of weak brigades and these are useless when not used in a coalition like NATO.
Assuming all NATO members provide effective mechanised armour and infantry. Doubtful.

Challenger 3 is an upgrade of the current platform. Not a new tank. It will still be obsolete against an enemy like the Russians and is only designed as a stop gap until we procure an entirely new tank. Contracts for the Challenger upgrade have only just been signed. So, its completion is years away.

To make matters worse. We have a tiny capacity to actually 'lift' forces close to a battle zone. We're almost
completely dependent on the US for 'lift'. Even when we had substantial forces in Germany, this was a massive
problem. Lately we've started to preposition tanks and other heavy equipment back in Germany. But, the process
has hardly started, as far as I know.
You’re very well informed.....
 

FIFTY

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Pamir Highway passes through Tajikistan

View attachment 95786

I am not sure which to do first - Nepal or Tajikistan, both have incredible trekking

I can speak Farsi at a conversational level so I can get by pretty easily in Tajikistan as it's similar to Tajik. While Nepal is massively geared up to international tourists, not quite the wilds of Central Asia
 

Oneball

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I am not sure which to do first - Nepal or Tajikistan, both have incredible trekking

I can speak Farsi at a conversational level so I can get by pretty easily in Tajikistan as it's similar to Tajik. While Nepal is massively geared up to international tourists, not quite the wilds of Central Asia

Always good to know the local lingo so you can order a meal, what’s Farsi for boiled sheep balls?

Have a watch of Long Way Round the episodes across Russia and the ‘stans are great.
 

FIFTY

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Always good to know the local lingo so you can order a meal, what’s Farsi for boiled sheep balls?

Have a watch of Long Way Round the episodes across Russia and the ‘stans are great.

Usually the sheep's balls are served at breakfast cafes that serves "Kal-e pach-e" which basically means sheep head and offal.

Levison Green did "walking the caucuses - from Russian to Iran" where he trekked from Southern Russia to Iranian part of the Caspian Sea. I do recommend it - my family are from this part of the world as until the mid 19th Century it was part of the Persia until it fell to the Russian empire after a long period of war... Tangibly the region has never stopped resisting the Russians just look at Chechnya and Dagistan.
 
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You’re very well informed.....
Not so much these days. Once upon a time, it was my job. Now, I just read a bit, here and there. Not a lot changes.
The Army makes the Civil Service look like the most fleet of foot, cutting edge tech company. We all know that in reality, change in the Civil Service is glacial.
 
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Always good to know the local lingo so you can order a meal, what’s Farsi for boiled sheep balls?

Have a watch of Long Way Round the episodes across Russia and the ‘stans are great.
Do they taste like chicken, I wonder. Let's hope so.
I believe that in certain cultures, the dinner guest is offered the sheep's eyes? Regarded as a delicacy, I seem to recall.
 

Oneball

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Do they taste like chicken, I wonder. Let's hope so.
I believe that in certain cultures, the dinner guest is offered the sheep's eyes? Regarded as a delicacy, I seem to recall.

i think it’s an international custom. Give the foreigners something they’ll find offensive to eat, black pudding anyone?
 
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