4200 Clutch replacement

Delmonte

Member
Messages
648
Do you need SD2 diagnostics, (or any other specialist equipment) to change the clutch? Or could it be done by a (trusted, competent) generic garage (as opposed to a specialist)?
 

Mr S

Member
Messages
595
Is it a manual or CC? CC has to be set up with SD i believe, the manual cars can be done by any competent mechanic.
 

Mr S

Member
Messages
595
No personal experience with it, but maybe the mechanical side is DIYable, then set up etc needs a specialist on SD2. Im sure someone with more experience than me will be along shortly, but have you tried a forum search?
 

Navcorr

Member
Messages
3,832
Do you need SD2 diagnostics, (or any other specialist equipment) to change the clutch? Or could it be done by a (trusted, competent) generic garage (as opposed to a specialist)?
You'll need diagnostics to set PIS & clutch config table. Maybe of use to you/your garage to read/view:


Plus a couple of videos - bearing release touched on in the 2nd part:

 

Delmonte

Member
Messages
648
Wow, that seems pretty conclusive... Not for the inexperienced garage without SD2 then.... Thanks
 

Navcorr

Member
Messages
3,832
You're quite close to Autoshield in Manchester I believe?
Marios is regarded by many as "the" expert in setting up a CC box.
 

Thumperuk

Junior Member
Messages
89
I have not tried this yet, but it has been reported on the ML forum that the Launch X431 can be used to set the PIS and bleed the F1 system.
Yes it can but it has to be launch software module 10.95 onwards.
 

masertel

Centenary Club
Messages
92
I'm no mechanic but have successfully fitted 3 clutch's to my Spyder and 4200 over the last 12 years. Both are manual so no SD needed but it is labour intensive and takes me about 20 hours with tea breaks and flaffing around- thankfully I have a 2 post lift as without one would be a nightmare.

I watched the video of the guy in Australia fitting the clutch and hats off to him or anyone doing this as a hobby. He did a great job and was glad to see him change the crank seal, spigot bearing and output shaft bearing as these can get overlooked. I did spot one small hiccup in the video though- when fitting the flywheel the shim should be placed on the front of the flywheel not the back but he is correct that the bolt holes in the shim and flywheel need to be lined up exactly the same as when removed or all the bolts will not fit. Not sure if fitting the shim on the wrong side off the flywheel will cause any major problems but it will push the clutch slightly more onto the thrust bearing and may affect the starter motor engaging properly.

For my sins I also have a couple of CC 4200's and in preparation for the day I will have to change the clutch bit the Bullet and got myself a Launch X431 Pro. Having pugged it into the CC it seems to have all the function needed to change a CC clutch but haven't used it in earnest yet.

Bottom line is if you are leaving your CC in with a mechanic best to make sure they have successfully replaced the clutch in a CC 4200 previously and don't volunteer to be a Guinea Pig!! With the stick shift 4200 however any competent mechanic should be up to the job but make sure they change the spigot bearing, flywheel, thrust bearing, output shaft bearing and with the age of these cars now the crank oil seal to be on the safe side.
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
31,568
You are supposed to set the clutch up as a new clutch zeroing all the legacy data. Also you need to fire the pump so you can bleed it and set the PIS point

The only thing I would say is essential to do this job is a full height lift.

The clutch job as a whole is very expensive but we only charge £750 to fit it which in the grand scheme of things is about 25% of the total charge so why put yourself through the pain to save so little.
 

RJ237

Junior Member
Messages
64
That's why I took mine to Enzo's in Atlanta. Not relevant to those who live elsewhere, but just a reinforcement to leave this particular repair to the experts. There are few repairs that I would hesitate to take on, including the heater core replacement, but the clutch replacement is a definite.
 

FL510

New Member
Messages
19
At the other extreme, you haven’t changed a clutch until you’ve done it in a Hong Kong shipping container on jack stands !

I went down this rabbit hole after a calculated punt on a bargain 2002 Cambiocorsa a few years back, trouble here is how expensive oem shops are and lack of trust/confidence. (Reason why I got such a bargain)

BMW for example disconnected my E46 power window switch’s claiming the module had failed $$ along with a bunch of other stuff, just drove car in for a service, windows worked fine so knew something was up and sure enough when home had a look myself and 4 window switches had been unplugged ! (At a BMW service centre!) Friends quoted whole engine or gearbox changes required....nuts, but that’s here as an expat.

So it really depends where you live and level of confidence, I’m know there are plenty of top workshops in other parts of the world and if I had the option certainly would have gone that way.

Other than the constraints of a shipping container and jack stands all went fine. I put in a new flywheel and Hill Engineering throw out bearing. You don’t need to disconnect half shafts, can move gearbox back enough inches to get torque tube out. Flushed/bleed the fluid at clutch and gearbox quick disconnect bleed nipples.

I was concerned about PIS and expected to need adjustment but being a 2002 it’s “SOFAST” 1 version you can only change the KISS point value manually where as the later “SOFAST2” cars have a KISS point “procedure” including SD3 10 x open/close cycles to calc KISS point plus clutch wear degradation value reset etc more involved

I haven’t had to adjust my PIS setting yet, clutch engagement and shifts are perfect, new flywheel/clutch must have been spot on for current PIS value, a bit fortunate there as I’ve read there are variations in new clutch thickness which would affect engagement requiring PIS value adjustment.

So the clutch change itself is ok but be prepared to take it to specialist for PIS setting fettling and clutch degradation index reset depending on your sofast version, early cars X431 might be enough but later cars SD3 specialist


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spkennyuk

Member
Messages
4,930
So the clutch change itself is ok but be prepared to take it to specialist for PIS setting fettling and clutch degradation index reset depending on your sofast version, early cars X431 might be enough but later cars SD3 specialist


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The Launch X431 will do any CC 4200 or GS regardless of sofast version as long as the X431 maserati module software is 10.95 or higher. Current version is 11.15.

Anything before 10.95 and you cant adjust the PIS point to 2 decimal places. So you can only set the PIS to say 4.0 or 5.0. Version 10.95 onwards you can set at say 4.85 for example.
 
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Delmonte

Member
Messages
648
FYI we always set new PIS at 4.65, it’s a good aggressive starting point and rarely have to adjust it.
Btw whats PIS?
And does this mean there is something that can be done about that horrible feeling when you want a fast launch, floor the throttle, and nothing happens? You just want to be able to drop the clutch like you would in a manual? I mean is there adjustment possible here? I've heard different theories on this, even from mechanics at the same specialist...
 

exporschdrivr

Junior Member
Messages
42
...

Other than the constraints of a shipping container and jack stands all went fine. I put in a new flywheel and Hill Engineering throw out bearing. You don’t need to disconnect half shafts, can move gearbox back enough inches to get torque tube out. Flushed/bleed the fluid at clutch and gearbox quick disconnect bleed nipples.

...


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Did you detach the gearbox from the subframe or did you move it on the subframe bolts? Need the mufflers to come off to have enough space to move the gearbox backwards or could they stay in place?

Thanks for answer
 

Spartacus

Member
Messages
3,035
Take the exhaust off up to the downpipes . Take out the boot floor and cross brace. Then wiggle the gear box back enough to remove the torque tube.