4200 - Changing Rear Arms

[GraemeA]

Greetings fellow owners

I had the front arms changed by a local garage, but not being overly impressed I've decided to do the rear ones myself. I've bought both front and rear from Eurospares and am very pleased with their service. These are the pattern units at 395 GBP each. The garage said the front ones need reaming to fit, which cost me extra...

I've also bought some new boot covers for the rear uppers from Craig Waterman as the existing ones have crumbled to nothing, so am planning on doing those at the same time.

My problem is that I can't get the balljoints off. I invested in a ball joint kit for my air chisel as per Craig's video, but I've managed to get the LH bottom one out about 6mm but no further. I'm also having no luck with using the double nut method to remove the stud bolt. It simply doesn't budge.

I just wondered if anyone else had the same issue and how they solved it. I'll try using a heat gun tomorrow night and see if that helps.

I'll be grateful for any ideas.

Cheers

Graeme

 

[safrane]

Im sure Phil will be along soon with some advice. ..abd ge is far more local than most of us.

 

[davy83]

These can be a bit of a pain to get off. i dont remember having to resort to a blow lamp to get my ball joints apart, i think lots of WD40 and a hammer. I also vaguely remember one of them i removed the hub carrier and got it up on my bench vice to split it. it can be a problem for sure.

 

[GraemeA]

Well it took a lot of hammering and CRC, but I did eventually get the lower ball joint out. I had to take off the lower arm and remove the mounting stud from the ball joint using a vice and pipe wrench on the bench, as you did Davy. There was no way it would budge using the locked nuts method. Since the ball joint is knackered I'll be replacing the whole lower arm anyway.

When I removed the lower arm, predictably the shims fell out in a heap that will be interesting to sort out.

I've now partially freed the upper ball joint but it's proving equally reluctant to free and again the stud won't undo with the locked nuts method. The upper ball joint looks okay so I'm hoping I can free it from the wheel carrier without having to remove the arm. I'll just have to suck it and see.

I'm about 4 hours into this now and haven't done one side yet.

 

[philw696]

Evening Graeme firstly I always put painted on the shims different colors so I can put them back.
Makes it easier for wheel alignment.
From my experiences NZ cars come apart a lot easier that UK ones as next to none corrosion issues due to salt on wet winter roads.
Shame your not closer as I would pop by.
You didn't fancy Winger Maserati giving you a price then ?

 

[GraemeA]

Hi Phil,

That was a great tip about paint on the shims which I'll use on the rhs.

I'd actually forgotten to look out for them. I can see how they were arranged so its not too bad. Yes, with it being corrosion free I thought it would come apart easier, but perhaps it's start in Singapore means they're stuck harder together. And, yes I wish you were closer as well. I'm sure I'll get there in the end though and I didn't consider Wingers as it's a trip to Auckland. I'll have a better go at it in the weekend.

Cheers

 

[conaero]

Balljoint freeing method:

1. Undo balljoint as much as possible
2. A liberal soaking in penetrating fluid over night
3. Open door on affected side
4. Stand on sill, grab roof and bounce (optional playing of "staying alive" on the cars hifi)
5. Repeat in the boot if unsuccessful
6. Wait for a CRACK!
7. Wave at your neighbours who think you have finally lost it

 

[GraemeA]

Hi all

Well I have the lower wishbone removed but I'm still stuck on the top one.

I wasn't able to get the stud out with the twin nut method, but I have broken the balljoint but with the stud still in it:



Now I was hoping I could just unbolt the upper arm and remove it but when I come to do that the rear bolt fouls on the body:



Should I be able to remove the upper arm without having to lower the rear cage, as it appears?

Or am I better off refitting the ball joint and making a more concerted effort at removing the stud?

Does anyone have any advice please?

 

[miket]

Lower the subframe to give more clearance for the bolt? At a guess.....

 

[SteveM]

When I had to replace top arm on my 3200 I recall I had to drop sub frame just enough to remove bolt - that means removing the four main sub frame bolts plus the small brackets - I know the rear arms are the same on 4200 but with 3200 its a diff rather than box but I was able to leave everything else in place to just drop it an inch or so by supporting sub frame on jack.

 

[GraemeA]

Thanks for the info Steve and good to know.

I decided to tighten the arm bolts up and have another go at the stud. I used some "Mouse" oil on the stud, locktite on the twin nuts and managed to get the stud out. I've now installed the new boot cover on the re-greased ball joint and installed the new lower arm. The shims were a bit of a battle but it's all good. I'd measured the tie rod length beforehand and the new one was easier to fit than I thought.


Just the other side to do now which will be much faster, now I've done the first, then off for another wheel alignment.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Wally]

For everyone Reading this thread: the original parts are produced by Ocap. Their balljoint covers are rubbish... on my Alfa 164 they disintegrated after 1 year. So if you take these components apart: Check carefully and/or replace with good quality equivalents!

 

[GraemeA]

Well, I've nearly finished the job. I've had an issue getting one of the nuts off, that I used on the upper ball joint stud, which has become hard to remove. I've bought a nut splitter to solve the problem.

I had to make a thin 27mm spanner to hold the ball joints as I replaced the studs and it didn't allow enough torque to get the locked on nut off. Once it's off I'll torque up the stud with the correct locking nut. I think my Chinese threadlock might be a bit too strong.

Bit worried about the ocap boot covers now. Is there anything you can put on them to prolong their lives? They are on the new repo arms. I have CWs on the rear uppers now.

Cheers

Graeme

 

[davy83]

There is some one on here who sells replacement ball joint covers for some of the ball joints, and i have them on my car, vastly superior to the stock ones. The rubber covers are the biggest issue with these ball joints.