15years and then it’s leccy only!

[Navcorr]

Something I wrote to market an issue a year ago that seems ever more appropriate as time goes on. Life’s too short to drive boring cars, let’s enjoy them while we still can.

Choose life.

 

[Wattie]

I'll be 70 if this leccy or other drive system legislation comes into force.
By then I intend to be fat, lazy and will look very stupid in any form of sports car. I look forward to being able to comment to anyone I see driving one how **** it sounds and how life was so much better back in the good old days.

As a result and after very little debate I don't give a feck about how my "golf buggy' or "mobility scooter" will be powered 15 years from now.

 

[Oishi]

Cobalt, lithium, neodymium, etc. Radioactive (when mined) elements that are dangerous to mine, refine, use and then to dispose of. Google the Longnan mine in China. It is a radioactive death pit with no environmental safe guards. This is what the rush to make EV's, wind turbines, PV cells has brought about. Add the fact that there is not enough generating capacity to replace the energy density of hydrocarbon fuels, and the safe portability of these liquid fuels and you have an economic disaster waiting to happen. People listen to Greta and think they are saving the world, when they are actually causing more environmental damage. Sorry, just a sore point with me.

 

[CatmanV2]

When I was working at a 'nuclear power station' - secret, made stuff for MoD, me and my mate, the Chief Reactor Physicist talked about this, and the reactor in Nuclear sub is about as big as an old dustbin ie not wheelie bin, though that does work, just didn't exist then, pretty small, but a sub is pretty big, so we worked out a car one would only need be the size of a teacup, or a man-sized mug for a Maser,

Can we get Sports Direct mug sized one?


C

 

[philw696]

With regards working on Hybrids after many years of working on normal stuff that had push rod engines and points and condensers I certainly find them a little scary.
As for the big thick orange gloves they are something else along with your plastic spanner and socket sets.
Did a lot with the new Rav 4 last year have a sit on the back seat of one where you strap your kids to right on top of the batteries.
No room for the seat base so it's as thin as and uncomfortable as Dem penetrating you.

 

[Silvercat]

Everyone who thinks that they are doing the right thing by buying an EV needs to watch some YouTube videos on cobalt and lithium production. Here is one of many:

It also takes 5 times more energy consumption to produce a BEV vs a conventional car. So sadly BEV's are far from being the answer.
The DRC is the only significant source of Cobalt in the world ,a critical element for batteries in BEV's. The real irony is to get at it, they need to clear milions of acres of rain forests which again is having a massively negative environmental impact, let alone the child exploitation impacts etc. This is typical of Govt and authorities all over the world not having a real joined up strategy to address the problem....blimey I'm sounding like Greta Thunberg.

 

[Silvercat]

Apparently all the services are trained as to what they can and cant do in event of attending an accident involving an EV. They carry a plastic shepherds crook in case a colleague is electrocuted and they can pull them away from the car. Mechanics servicing an EV need to wear protective gear. (Masks, suits and rubber boots) I am told there were several fatalities last year in the UK with mechanics not waiting long enough after disconnecting the battery before they touched the car. I think Jaguar say they must wait 11 minutes from disconnecting the battery. Some garages are now refusing to work on an EV.

And if you are unfortunate enough to have an accident in a EV/BEV and there is a battery fire, then it can take upto 3 days to put the fire out. Would make travelling on any motorway very interesting. Just make sure you always pack some food, water and a change of clothes..... just in case!!
Another great example of how F----- up the EV strategy is.

 

[Silvercat]

Cobalt, lithium, neodymium, etc. Radioactive (when mined) elements that are dangerous to mine, refine, use and then to dispose of. Google the Longnan mine in China. It is a radioactive death pit with no environmental safe guards. This is what the rush to make EV's, wind turbines, PV cells has brought about. Add the fact that there is not enough generating capacity to replace the energy density of hydrocarbon fuels, and the safe portability of these liquid fuels and you have an economic disaster waiting to happen. People listen to Greta and think they are saving the world, when they are actually causing more environmental damage. Sorry, just a sore point with me.

Spot on!!!

 

[dickygrace]

Just a thought... 15 years is still five more cars on a PCP for most purchasers

When they’ve done 5 more PCP’s they’ve no chance of affording an electric car, although they may be able to stretch to a 2020 Zoe with a knackered battery by then.

 

[rockits]

We have known and sat on this issue for many many years and done little to nothing to move forward. Now it has become a real problem so there is a rush to do something about it. I am no Prince PM or planner but isn't this strategy slightly flawed, reactive and a quick easy immediately knee jerk reaction that will not fix the problem?

A clearly well thought out short, medium and long term strategy should be created. Trouble is this should have been done 10+ years ago. We always take too long to do something then rush to do a plaster fix. Just do it properly in the first place regardless of the short term cost or pain. We have some very very clever people on this planet and this is the best we can dream up.....hilarious.

There are so many things we can change tomorrow. IMHO every new house built should be self sufficient and leaving a zero carbon footprint at the very least. Bold? Maybe but that is what is required. We still are building properties with no solar panels, with no high speed fibre infrastructure and less parking then ever. Very short sighted. At the build stage this is the perfect time to do what is required except we are doing most of the builds the same way we have done it for the last 10/20/30 years.

There needs to be some new thinking as even with solar systems in houses we still need to store energy in something like a battery form. We either need to design a battery that can last 100 years and think how we can re-generate them to be re-charged/re-used for several lifetimes.

I just don't think we are often bold or brash enough to really make a long term lasting change. We will all do the EV thing the same as the govt told us to buy diesels and in 5-10 years time there problem will be bigger. A plaster isn't the answer.

 

[Silvercat]

We have known and sat on this issue for many many years and done little to nothing to move forward. Now it has become a real problem so there is a rush to do something about it. I am no Prince PM or planner but isn't this strategy slightly flawed, reactive and a quick easy immediately knee jerk reaction that will not fix the problem?

A clearly well thought out short, medium and long term strategy should be created. Trouble is this should have been done 10+ years ago. We always take too long to do something then rush to do a plaster fix. Just do it properly in the first place regardless of the short term cost or pain. We have some very very clever people on this planet and this is the best we can dream up.....hilarious.

There are so many things we can change tomorrow. IMHO every new house built should be self sufficient and leaving a zero carbon footprint at the very least. Bold? Maybe but that is what is required. We still are building properties with no solar panels, with no high speed fibre infrastructure and less parking then ever. Very short sighted. At the build stage this is the perfect time to do what is required except we are doing most of the builds the same way we have done it for the last 10/20/30 years.

There needs to be some new thinking as even with solar systems in houses we still need to store energy in something like a battery form. We either need to design a battery that can last 100 years and think how we can re-generate them to be re-charged/re-used for several lifetimes.

I just don't think we are often bold or brash enough to really make a long term lasting change. We will all do the EV thing the same as the govt told us to buy diesels and in 5-10 years time there problem will be bigger. A plaster isn't the answer.

If we are all having these very intelligent and logical discussions around this tricky subject then why aren't the policymakers, energy strategists and guru's doing the same. It just beggars belief.

 

[CatmanV2]

If we are all having these very intelligent and logical discussions around this tricky subject then why aren't the policymakers, energy strategists and guru's doing the same. It just beggars belief.

Maybe they know more than we do....

C

 

[allandwf]

If we are all having these very intelligent and logical discussions around this tricky subject then why aren't the policymakers, energy strategists and guru's doing the same. It just beggars belief.

Because they want to make money!

 

[dickygrace]

We have known and sat on this issue for many many years and done little to nothing to move forward. Now it has become a real problem so there is a rush to do something about it.

I honestly don’t think it has become a real problem, I just think it is made out to be one. CO2 emissions aren’t ever going to be reduced worldwide, the only solution is to invent something (such as trees) which absorb/convert CO2. We cannot deny the developing world their industrialisation, and are in no position to dictate to these countries.

 

[rockits]

I honestly don’t think it has become a real problem, I just think it is made out to be one. CO2 emissions aren’t ever going to be reduced worldwide, the only solution is to invent something (such as trees) which absorb/convert CO2. We cannot deny the developing world their industrialisation, and are in no position to dictate to these countries.

I normally am very aligned with you Dicky but have to disagree on this one. I do think it is a problem. Maybe not one that is rearing its ugly head so obvious at the moment but it will do and is doing maybe to a lesser extent.

I do agree a solution to absorb and convert would be very useful. I just think our modern lives have become too and over complex and we are sometimes lesser because of it. I think it needs a multi faceted approach with various actions combining to create a much bigger impact. We take an inordinate amount of unnecessary journey's because we can or it is easy or convenient. Our mindsets need to change and yes we in the UK are a mere spec in the bigger picture. The globe has to take action collectively. The danger is this is how world wars are started.

The idea of doing something before it becomes a problem seems to be very foreign to most. The 3rd world countries do not have the resources or knowledge often to know they need to change. It is our responsibility to educate and help. I am sure these countries can still teach us a thing or two about various things.

I always mention the concept of land fill. What intelligent people got round a table to discuss what are we going to do with all our rubbish? Lets bury it underground. Comical. Sure that makes sense and is never going to rear its ugly head at any point is it?!

 

[dickygrace]

I normally am very aligned with you Dicky but have to disagree on this one. I do think it is a problem. Maybe not one that is rearing its ugly head so obvious at the moment but it will do and is doing maybe to a lesser extent.

I do agree a solution to absorb and convert would be very useful. I just think our modern lives have become too and over complex and we are sometimes lesser because of it. I think it needs a multi faceted approach with various actions combining to create a much bigger impact. We take an inordinate amount of unnecessary journey's because we can or it is easy or convenient. Our mindsets need to change and yes we in the UK are a mere spec in the bigger picture. The globe has to take action collectively. The danger is this is how world wars are started.

The idea of doing something before it becomes a problem seems to be very foreign to most. The 3rd world countries do not have the resources or knowledge often to know they need to change. It is our responsibility to educate and help. I am sure these countries can still teach us a thing or two about various things.

I always mention the concept of land fill. What intelligent people got round a table to discuss what are we going to do with all our rubbish? Lets bury it underground. Comical. Sure that makes sense and is never going to rear its ugly head at any point is it?!

I completely agree about landfill and a lot of our issues. I just don’t agree that pushing people into buying an EV and concentrating on reducing individual transport emissions is of any benefit whatsoever.

 

[rockits]

I agree EV isn't the way forward. We need to be thinking much further ahead. A massive shift and infrastructure needed to achieve not a lot and just shifting the issue.

 

[Hurricane52]

Lime mortar absorbs CO2 as it carbonates. Cement manufacturing is the third biggest man made contributor to C02 levels, after burning fossil fuels and deforestation.

Everyone needs to do their little bit to make a difference. I’ve reduced my cups of tea to one a day, to offset the number of times my old man boils the kettle as he gets older. As the population ages, this will be grabbing headlines sooner or later.

 

[Hurricane52]

And another thing. Buildings made with lime can be recycled. Cement buildings and plastic windows end up in landfill.

Here’s a wooden car in a rubbish attempt to get back on thread.

 

[GeoffCapes]

Sorry to cut your post so much but I wanted to address this point. I’ve been banging on at people who consider themselves green, for ages regarding this. One guy in particular who’s on his second electric car in 2 years. My cars are 10/15/14 years old and will go for many years yet. How much energy emissions and resources to build a car? I’d love to know that. But a figure banded around for a long time was 90% of an engined cars’ lifetime emissions are in its construction. Impossible to quantify, but the ripples go on for ever, all the factories involved in the construction of components around the world, raw materials mining, transporting, shaping, packaging, labour, millions of miles of shipping stuff.... I drive past scrapyards full of 12 year old cars piled up, and know there’s nothing wrong with 90 odd percent of that car, just thinking, this is madness. Building whole new cars to replace a small brown part, or a bit of corrosion. Plus, it’s widely known that electric cars’ energy to build is worse (they are heavier, and battery materials come from parts of the world where cars aren’t built....)

I read somewhere that an EV car needs to do something like 120k to bring the 'lifetime' emissions to below that of an ICE car.

Will see if I can find the article.