Rant

[zagatoes30]

The problem is Maserati as a brand has never had a strong enough Brand following. It falls in between a number of market sectors which makes it extremely difficult to put together a strong case for significant investment very similar to the issue with Lancia.

Simple fact Alfa Romeo is a better known brand at a lower entry point, it always has been. It is much easy to build an investment model when you can align to a sector. Alfa have pretensions to take some sales off BMW. Audi, Jaguar & Merc and hence are putting together an offering to target this sector.

But what is the Maserati sector? Do we agree? IMO Jaguar are the nearest direct competitor but even they have built significantly more cars overs the years and at lower entry points. These days with the XE, XF, F-Pace, XJ & the F Type they have a lot of basis covered.

Other than a small number of enthusiasts like us most of the public don't know what Maserati is. Potentially a competitor for Porsche, high performing sports GT cars but with a perception of higher running costs and depreciation. Other than the QP V Maserati saloons have always been the after thought built in relatively small numbers using the GT car engines. The brand has tried to expand the range, the BiTurbo in the 80s, 4200 / QPV in the 00s and now the Ghibli but the general public has just not bought enough of them.

I don't know the answer but I suspect that the brand we love will always struggle to find a consistent market. In all it's history this has been the case, occasional sales success in between times where they struggle to even survive. As enthusiasts we find this hard but that won't change the fact that to survive these days you need to sell cars and Maserati does not have the customer base to support the sales required to constantly develop new offerings. The Ghibli has sold well just not in the numbers the brand were hoping. The Levente might help bolster sales & opinion but they are always going to find it hard.

Maserati have always find things tough and today is no different

 

[outrun]

The trouble is the owner which is just a typical huge corporate with all their emphasis on profitability and shareholder value. It's a bit like Arsenal.

As fans of the brand, we just have to accept the reality of the grey and dull period in the history for now. Hold on to our Stradales, GS and GTSs and wait for them to have their moment of clarity and start to produce emotional products again. It will happen for sure, just no idea when.

 

[dem maser]

Perfect Athol.....Maserati is like Arsenal, except Arsenal is very rich and just tight with money whereas Maserati has not got a lot to work with

They have thrown **** loads on Jeep and Alfa and those brands are now desirable again, id buy a Renegade for example and i am owning a Giulia soon...i know that Maserati are more premium hence i cant afford one right now but they are not making naything desirable for you guys that can afford one either...so why should i buy a Ghibli?

What is a new Ghibli full fat worth? 70k?

i can have a Quadrifglio V6 for 60k with it being a better car in the sense its newer its faster and in my opinion looks meaner

 

[keith]

Just to stir the pot in a friendly way...
The problem with a 'rant' is it can allow utter garbage comments to taint some sensible points.
For sure the Ferrari link was a valuable marketing tool, and of course Maserati like Jaguar with the F Type needs at least one credible sports car. I heard a facelift GT is on the way, and I think an Alferi style sports car will still appear at some point.
However to say the Diesel sounds like a London Taxi is just plain daft, and as said so many times before its cars like the Ghibli and no doubt the Levente that secure the future of the company by attracting a new customer base from its natural rivals - Mercedes BMW Jaguar etc. I along with others I know, have all come from Jaguar.
Whilst charm looks and image would be enough to attract a small customer base to a sports car or luxury saloon, given the development budget and engineering talent would never be enough to offer a dynamic technologically advanced car to compete head on with the established German brands. The Ghibli and Levente are just about cheap enough to attract with lure of driving a Maserati instead of one of the ubiquitous rivals. Hence the increased sales.
Given the tools the company has to work with I think the management are following the absolute correct policy.

I th

 

[MrMickS]

More for the pot.

Maserati registered 995 cars in Europe in January.


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[allandwf]

For years the big Italian three, in desirability, rarity, and performance, used to Ferrari, Lamborghini, and Maserati. Be it myth or bar talk that perpetuated it, it still survived. It does seem to be lost on this generation now though. Maybe it's because so much more information is available to people now.

 

[alfatwo]

Perfect Athol.....Maserati is like Arsenal, except Arsenal is very rich and just tight with money whereas Maserati has not got a lot to work with

They have thrown **** loads on Jeep and Alfa and those brands are now desirable again, id buy a Renegade for example and i am owning a Giulia soon...i know that Maserati are more premium hence i cant afford one right now but they are not making naything desirable for you guys that can afford one either...so why should i buy a Ghibli?

What is a new Ghibli full fat worth? 70k?

i can have a Quadrifglio V6 for 60k with it being a better car in the sense its newer its faster and in my opinion looks meaner

I've driven both Dem, The Alfa is a gem quicker than any Maser and more of a sports car than the Ghibli

Don't get me wrong the Ghibli is very nice too, just very different, too big though

If I had 60k spare I'd be looking towards Milano!


Dave

 

[Andyk]

There is a different problem as well....

Maserati have never really made cars that have been the best in class. Nearly but never quite there....This never mattered to people like us as the other cars were not a Maserati ...... Not everyone gets this but only a Maserati will do........The problem now is that going into the sectors they are ... Especially the Ghibli....the customers expect the best and a car to be on a level playing fields at least with the competition.....And that's quality, after sales and reliability.....some of these issues still haven't been addressed and need to be. They aren't selling to the Maserati fan so much now and this new customer expects more.....I was reading the review of the Ghibli S in EVO...I would love this car as my everyday transport but 3.5 stars out of 5 it has to do better than that in the company it is keeping. Will the name Maserati mean anything to people other than the enthusiast.....Probably not so the product has to be the best or at least competitive......Alfa seems to have done this with the QV so no reason why Maserati can't get it right. The only car that seems to come close to best in class is the 4x4....Perhaps this will be their saviour maybe.....The new QP has had a very Luke warm response and when was the last time you say one on the road....I sure that some on here will say I'm living in the past but I get the range as others have said it is needed for the company to survive and this is what we all want but now Maserati needs to up its game with the product and then give us the odd gem we can all aspire to.

 

[MrMickS]

I don't put much trust in reviews, especially in the bracket that the Ghibli sits in. If you read them it tends to be "this is different to the BMW, this is different to the Mercedes" and is marked accordingly. So basically anything that is different isn't good. Should all cars be the same?


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[Andyk]

Mick, you are an enthusiast and I'm the same so I would a Ghibli S at the drop of a hat....its looks and sounds fantastic and yes while most on here would take a car review into there buying decision where a Maserati is concerned the company car buyer who buys a Ghibli diesel will and that's why the cars have to be better as if no public sees its better ar as good then they may go to Maserati instead of passing it by. The true th is the cars are not as polished or as competent as the competition and they need to be in this sector.....Not having a go as they are still good cars.

 

[MrMickS]

It was more a general thought Andy. A lot of reviewers tend towards being safe and being different is criticised. I had a Merc hire car when my car was recovered. I found the ride too low for a car in that class and the seats bloody awful. All reviewers say how sporting it feels.

If you pander to the reviewers the you're on design by committee and all you get are me too cars. Nothing very inspiring at all.


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[Andyk]

Yes I do agree that they sometimes play safe. Was reading the review last night in EVO and they had a downer on the engines.....they said it looked great and was probably the best looking car in class and said it went well but there was lots of challenging stuff in there that I really think Maserati should address. It really could be a great car instead of a very good one. The problem with the S is it is in the price range of an M5 or AMG and that's some very tough competition and yes they are very boring to look at but very, very capable cars and when reviewers start to mention these you know which way it will go.

I hear in magazines and on forums that Maserati are now a Jaguar competitor....I would have never put them together and have always put then above Jaguar but I suppose when you look at the range they are. I really struggle to think of them as A Jaguar type car as always thought they were more the Italian Aston Martin....They def have gone into different sectors over the last few years.

 

[MrMickS]

I watched an old Top Gear 'group test' the other day. QP, Rapide, and Panamera. That's where Maserati should be. I think the Ferrari association has dropped them down a little though, don't want to tread on Ferrari's toes. So they've moved a little down market.

I still think that they are above Jaguar in ambition but it's a worry if that becomes the general feeling as they'll always appear expensive in comparison. That said is that a bad thing as it keeps them more exclusive?

Oh. Missed a chance at a dig in my earlier reply. I don't care if the reviews put people off buying diesel Ghiblis. Diesels have no place in anything other than tractors, taxis, and commercial vehicles.


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[Needamaser]

I don't it matters much what car Maserati brings out until they address the perception of the bulk of the buying public that they are are unreliable and cost a fortune to run and repair. That leads then to poor residuals which in turn gives buyers another reason to buy elsewhere. There is no excuse in this day and age to produce an unreliable car which spends a lot of its time in the dealer being repaired.
How often have you had a conversation with someone who will tell you they wouldn't have one because they know someone who has had nothing but trouble with one. Ok some of it is exaggeration but sadly there is more than an element of truth in it.
We might forgive this as "character" but most buyers don't want to spend £80k on character.

 

[Needamaser]

The other thing to address is the after sales service. It is poor when enthusiasts like us are berating the dealers for their attention to problems and the factory not supporting dealers and being seen to rip off the owners.

 

[P R]

I'm not sure about older models but I don't think there have been any particular issues with the latest models reliability wise?
Part prices are another matter!

 

[Andyk]

No them seem better but it's as above changing the public perception which is not easy. I've not heard any bad experiences on here with the Ghibli but aaserati Ferrari mechanics Dad said they are a pain in the arise and he would touch one ???? Not sure what he means but have asked his Dad for details.

 

[safrane]

The current target market for Maserati is very fickle and swayed by fashion. Will the life cycle of the saloon and 4x4 range keep up with them when BMW, Audi, MB are able to bring out a new model every few years?

Will this fickle market want a Maserati offer that looks like the same car they bought three years ago?

A little more power and a spoiler or two and some new alloys will not be enough when the competition has moved on.

The GT has lived on its looks for far too long... the rest will unlikely be so lucky.

 

[P R]

That's a good point Safrane. Apart from a new infotainment system and some new minor cosmetics the Ghibli is exactly the same. It needs a twin turbo D at the very least.

 

[MrMickS]

That's a good point Safrane. Apart from a new infotainment system and some new minor cosmetics the Ghibli is exactly the same. It needs a twin turbo D at the very least.

I don't understand why this wasn't part of the MY17 refresh. For that matter is it possible to fit the V8tt into the Ghibli as a GTS version*. You could charge a fair bit more for it and it at least looks like you remember the heritage.

* We know that the chassis can handle it, the gearbox too. The questions are whether the AWD drive system for the LHD Ghiblis can cope and whether it would fit under the bonnet. As the QP VI is just a long Ghibli I would have hoped it would, though it would be a tight squeeze.