Coupe prices - what's happening?

[Mattmaser]

Ref Landrovers - I’ve got a 2020 Defender 110 with 49k miles, new one has arrived - dealers are desperate for used defenders and are paying strong money for them

 

[RoaryRati]

clearly I'm a little mad

I know I am

 

[urquattrogus]

There must be a few new stock or pre reg cars starting to pile up on airport runways and the like now. Plenty of exceptions to that I’m sure but it’s just supply and demand as always. Supply now starting to outstretch demand new and used it seems….?

 

[Ewan]

Most cars are built to order now, so there’s far less stock than would have been the case in recessions of times gone by. And with parts shortages, there are still back logs. At Land Rover, for example, the order book is over 100,000 cars (hence the long lead times).

 

[midlifecrisis]

Most cars are built to order now, so there’s far less stock than would have been the case in recessions of times gone by. And with parts shortages, there are still back logs. At Land Rover, for example, the order book is over 100,000 cars (hence the long lead times).

Let me qualify that for you, most 'desirable' cars are built to order. Have you seen an aerial view of Bruntingthorpe recently?

Some of the excuses I've seen for selling their Maserati are quite laughable too.

 

[urquattrogus]

I think some factories are starting to go to half shifts etc; if stock is not selling, dealers are not ordering stock the whole sausage machine grinds to a halt.

If most cars are built to order but there are not enough orders, what do you do with the factory? close it down or keep the place building at half shifts etc

Now that holding any kind of stock for any length of time is at essentially 8.5% borrowing cost I can't see dealers wanting to hold pre pandemic stock levels when borrowing was at about 2%, the stock is more likely to pile up on the airfield...

Suddenly the direct sales approach vs dealer might look even less attractive for manufacturers? They will want dealers to carry the can again?

 

[Ewan]

Let me qualify that for you, most 'desirable' cars are built to order. Have you seen an aerial view of Bruntingthorpe recently?

Some of the excuses I've seen for selling their Maserati are quite laughable too.

Good point. Companies such as Land Rover, Audi, Volvo, and the like all build to order. As do all the smaller manufacturers such as Lotus, Ferrari, Lambo, etc. But I can imagine that the Fords of this World still plough ahead with mass production. (Which is not to say that a Ford, or similar, is not desirable, before I get shouted at!!!)

On this topic, I ordered a new Audi about 9 week ago. At that time they were quoting a lead time of towards 4 months. But I've just been told that the car has now been built, so should be ready for delivery shortly. So either they moved my car up the queue (highly unlikely!) or the queue is not as long as it was (far more likely).

 

[LDM 3200]

Years ago I had a tour of the Ford Dagenham plant when they still built cars (fiesta/mazda) and was told that all the cars on the line were already sold, so built to order, was strange to see, a mazda followed by a ford etc all individual colours, not what I expected at all.

 

[gb-gta]

Good point. Companies such as Land Rover, Audi, Volvo, and the like all build to order. As do all the smaller manufacturers such as Lotus, Ferrari, Lambo, etc. But I can imagine that the Fords of this World still plough ahead with mass production. (Which is not to say that a Ford, or similar, is not desirable, before I get shouted at!!!)

On this topic, I ordered a new Audi about 9 week ago. At that time they were quoting a lead time of towards 4 months. But I've just been told that the car has now been built, so should be ready for delivery shortly. So either they moved my car up the queue (highly unlikely!) or the queue is not as long as it was (far more likely).

Could be people cancelling orders too (maybe because of recent insane insurance cost increases)

 

[mjheathcote]

Could be people cancelling orders too (maybe because of recent insane insurance cost increases)

Friend has just taken delivery of a brand new RR Sport, over 6 months early than advised at time of order.
Phoned direct line to swop over the insurance from his previous RR Sport...no sir we don't insure those anymore!
All the usual wouldn't even quote, ended up paying £3k with Sheila's Wheels, an increase of over £2k!

 

[dickygrace]

Friend has just taken delivery of a brand new RR Sport, over 6 months early than advised at time of order.
Phoned direct line to swop over the insurance from his previous RR Sport...no sir we don't insure those anymore!
All the usual wouldn't even quote, ended up paying £3k with Sheila's Wheels, an increase of over £2k!

I believe it’s a 3 fold problem. Huge reliability, particularly engine, issues. Supply chain is in a huge backlog so hire car costs for accident damage are huge. They all get nicked so theft is likely and premiums soar.

 

[midlifecrisis]

They all get nicked so theft is likely and premiums soar.

My Neighbour Dave, was telling me the same just yesterday. His daughter's premiums have gone up three-fold. I said, she should get a supermini.

 

[gb-gta]

I believe it’s a 3 fold problem. Huge reliability, particularly engine, issues. Supply chain is in a huge backlog so hire car costs for accident damage are huge. They all get nicked so theft is likely and premiums soar.

The hire car cost thing I think is still a big scam. Sure, repairs may take longer if waiting for parts, but I’m sure some are taking advantage.

Guy at work had minor rear end nudge on his A5 tdi, bumper and exhaust damage as below. They strung out repair for 2 months, saying they were waiting for an exhaust back box, during which time he was given a Audi TTS convertible……. I’m guessing the ‘hire’ cost was probably 2-250/day? So about £15k, plus repair costs, which I think he said they charged 5 or 6k……

Car is worth about £10k max….

 

[allandwf]

All these tales of woe surely make a 4200 a better proposition!

 

[mjheathcote]

The hire car cost thing I think is still a big scam. Sure, repairs may take longer if waiting for parts, but I’m sure some are taking advantage.

Guy at work had minor rear end nudge on his A5 tdi, bumper and exhaust damage as below. They strung out repair for 2 months, saying they were waiting for an exhaust back box, during which time he was given a Audi TTS convertible……. I’m guessing the ‘hire’ cost was probably 2-250/day? So about £15k, plus repair costs, which I think he said they charged 5 or 6k……

Car is worth about £10k max….

View attachment 120084

This totally.
When I was rearended 4 years ago I was given a brand new BMW 5 series M Sport while mine was being repaired. They did try to fleece me on collection for a micro scratch in the metallic black paint (funny that) on collection...which they said the whole rear wing would require respraying. When I said give me a minute and I appeared with my DA polisher, they backed down completely 'it's okay, no damage sir' complete SCAM!!!

 

[Will79]

Just looking on Autoscout24 and Gransports seem to be nearly double what they are in the UK. Seems a bigger difference than I would have expected.

 

[allandwf]

Just looking on Autoscout24 and Gransports seem to be nearly double what they are in the UK. Seems a bigger difference than I would have expected.

That's normal at least x2 if not more for a good LHD example.

 

[williamsmix]

That's normal at least x2 if not more for a good LHD example.

I think they have a greater appreciation of cars in Europe, at least of some of Italy's finest products! I know that people wanted to take pictures of my 3200 and talk to me about it when I drove it across France this summer, which surprised me. Here in the UK it mostly gets ignored and is a bit anonymous because most people don't know what it is!

 

[philw696]

Just looking on Autoscout24 and Gransports seem to be nearly double what they are in the UK. Seems a bigger difference than I would have expected.

I'm looking on there regularly it's the same for most cars it seems when comparing to UK prices.
I visited a French Independent Dealer like Richard Grace in the Summer and follow him and he's selling Maseratis every month it seems along with other nice cars.
He was in the mountains in the Averyon buys from all over Europe and even sells back to other EU countries a very busy guy doing exactly what his passion is.

 

[Church of Noise]

Yes, prices and typically taxes are higher on the continent sadly...

BTW @philw696 , who's the dealer you mention?