Clutch failure, Release Bearing or Something Else?

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Elliott653

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1,241
I had my 2005, 4200CC checked out by H.R. Owen in May. One of the things mentioned in their report was that the clutch release bearing was leaking oil and would eventually fail.

They suggested replacing it, along with the clutch itself which diagnosis indicated was 78% worn. I decided to leave the work until the next service in October.

Over the next few months, I noticed on a handful of occasions, the car would "pop" out of reverse as I engaged it. However, when re-engaged, everything would work as normal.

Fast forward to this morning. I always drive with the car in "sport mode'. We were headed out for the day and I noticed that the gear change had become sluggish and hesitant. As I drove along another mile or so, an intermittent warning beep went off as I tried to change gear.

Fearing something was about to fail, I turned around and headed for home. The last part of the short journey passed without either a "beep" or a hesitant gear change. Everything seemed to have cleared. As if the car had warmed up.

I was wondering whether anyone knew what was going on? Before I set out, my OH had asked what the "MSP" button was for. I explained and pressed it. The light didn't coming on at first, it took a couple of presses for it to do so. Does that make sense with regard to this problem?

We're headed up to Suffolk next weekend. I wouldn't want to come back on an AA truck.

Any ideas as to what could be the problem??

Thanks
 
safrane

safrane

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16,905
You will need to press the MSP button for 3-5 seconds to make it work...I doubt the problem is linked, but the SD3 % can be up to 5-10% out so yours could be up to 80%+ worn
 
Klive

Klive

Junior Member
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724
Just a thought, if your release bearing is leaking oil then it could get onto the clutch. Maybe, maybe not, be burnt off.(I expect you would probably notice some clutch slip or oil drips under the car). If that's the case your hydraulic fluid could be low and this is only recognised going up or downhill, so your beeping maybe caused by low oil.
 
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Elliott653

Member
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1,241
Ah. I see what you mean. No warning light came on. Just a random beeping which stopped after the car warmed up.
 
lozcb

lozcb

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12,586
Elliott said:
Thanks for that, Safrane. I was aware that the clutch reading isn't completely accurate.
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7


Elliot , advanced clutch wear symptoms are....................slow lazy pull away, 5th or 6th gear indicator flashing , dropping out of gear when rapidly changing down for junctions roundabouts, occasional slippage and burning smell etc , just recieved my old clutch back from Dick lovetts, it was supposedly 102% worn in October 2009 (no symptoms ) comparing , it doesn't look to much different than Urby's clutch which was only 30% worn when changed , since then 2 years on i did 17K miles and the slippage only started a few months back but the dropping out of gear became progressively worse and more common , My release bearing was also leaking grease slightly , and looking at it pretty sure there isn't enough seepage to affect the clutch plate itself to slip,

I reckon as Klive says , its more than likely F1 pump problems , the older model relays up to 2005 are prone to sticking thus burning out the pumps ,low fluid may also cause your problem, i would start by changing the relay , and be prepared to change a pump , there are several posts on this on the tech section , the pump itself is the same as an Alfa selespeed pump around £280 plus vat

regards loz
 
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conaero

conaero

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34,656
Loz, can we see a pic of said clutch plate, would like to see just how bad it was.

It might not be a bad idea to do a little guide on all the parts, and what fails, spigot bearing etc, like a definitive clutch thread.
 
lozcb

lozcb

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12,586
Conaero said:
Loz, can we see a pic of said clutch plate, would like to see just how bad it was.

It might not be a bad idea to do a little guide on all the parts, and what fails, spigot bearing etc, like a definitive clutch thread.
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Yeah will do Matt, just got back from holls last night, so i'll pick this back up in a day or two .............. waiting for the track day now havent had a decent drive in weeks, but i was really impressed with the roads in Rhodes but sadly i had 3 passengers and a Ford Focus which didn't quite cut the mustard


regards loz



regards loz
 
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Elliott653

Member
Messages
1,241
Thanks Loz. Doesn't sound like clutch problems. Although, very occasionally, the car slips out of reverse when selected. However, it always works correctly when re-engaged.

I'll check the F1 pumps threads.
 
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Elliott653

Member
Messages
1,241
Is there a thread on here that details how to replace the F1 pump and/or relay? One of my best mates is an independent Alfa specialist. I'm hoping that he could do the job, if necessary.

Thanks
 
conaero

conaero

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34,656
There is also this which is very helpful and informative:

[video=youtube;r6jh5SV8t1w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6jh5SV8t1w[/video]
 
conaero

conaero

Forum Owner
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34,656
Here is some info on altenate parts:

yeah could one for the F1 pump and relay aswell spoke to Marios Autoshield today and he confirmed it

Alfa selespeed pump part no 51736315 £319 plus Vat same as Maserati F1 pump Eurospares £950.00

Alfa cooling fan relay 30 amp £8.40 inc Vat same as Maserati F1 pump relay £35.00

regards loz
Click to expand...

And here is a link to purchase the Alfa Selespeed pump:

http://www.shop4parts.co.uk/?name=store&op=Details&ProdID=3319&sku=9321
 
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Elliott653

Member
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1,241
I think my first option is to replace the F1 relay. The more I read about this issue, the more it seems to me that the relay stuck, giving me the sluggish change and intermittent warning beeps. I took the car out for a short spin around the block this morning and everything was as normal. The pump primed for three seconds as usual and went off.

So, I'm off to the local Alfa dealer to get a new relay. If the problem returns, we'll fit a new pump.
 
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