Stopping distance...

[Ebenezer]

So I went for a spirited drive this morning and got to wondering about the efficacy of my brakes.....

So no one around, nice dry straight road and on with the anchors.....

I know people say that the brakes are no great shakes, but I was expecting something with a bit of bite. Rubbish! I couldn't even get the ABS to kick in. Tried several times thinking that perhaps they need warming up, but no appreciiable difference. What's the stopping distance supposed to be for a 4.2 QPV with standard disks and pads? Should the brakes be able to lock the wheels on a dry road and get the ABS kick in?

Eb

 

[allandwf]

I would have thought so. They have on all the cars I have had, the 3200 and all the Alfas.

 

[StuartW]

I would say that they're not working as they should

 

[2b1ask1]

A long travel and a spongy feel was actually engineered into them! You can pretty much stand on the pedal if you need to; unnerving but they do stop, it dos sound like they are not performing well though.As long as they are in better shape than Yeti found his in on the car he had just bought....

Worth spending some time on them perhaps, new fluid as well and possibly new flexible hoses if it is over 10 years old.

 

[alfatwo]

The original off the self 3200,4200 Brembo calipers are far to small for such a heavy car like ours....even with good modern pads the brakes are still rubbish!


Dave

 

[Swedish Paul]

I also have a Porsche. Stomp on the brakes, hardly ever get the ABS to kick in on a dry road. Car stops though. Do you really want a braking system where the ABS kicks in when dry? Surely damp/wet roads are were they save your a55.

I admit though, a little more progression would be helpful.

 

[c4sman]

Did a driving experience at the weekend at Mercedes world in a 567bhp CLS 63 (awesome car btw). We did dry and ice emergency stops from 90mph and 35mph respectively. One question I would ask you is were you really being as brutal as you need to be in your test as it took me a while to deliberately hit the anchors hard enough for the car to go into full crisis mode and do its assistive braking, which ultimately triggers the abs in the dry (no such problems on ice simulation). I even managed an emergency stop from 90mph with no hands on the steering wheel and the car pulled up perfectly straight!

One of the factors regarding abs being triggered (and traction off the line in the 0-90 test) was heat in the brakes and tyres. The instructor explained that just like F1 if you are driving quickly and using the brakes, the heat generated by them warms the wheel hub, then the wheel and ultimately the tyre itself. This increases the grip level majorly improving (to a point) acceleration, braking and cornering performance. The more grip in the tyres the higher the abs threshold.

You should probably test it in the wet (in a safe environment) or on cold tyres and if it doesn't trigger you may have a problem.

 

[npaskin]

My own QP V (a 4.7) certainly has no problem stopping. I had to do an emergency stop a few months ago when someone pulled out in front of me without looking – nearly lost my eyeballs and felt like someone had dropped an anvil on the car…. I have no idea if the ABS kicked in (it was a dry road) or the stopping distance but I would say “more than adequateâ€!

 

[Ebenezer]

Norman
snce your's is the 4.7 you probably have the bigger disks and calipres. If I get a chance I'll try again but with even more vigour on the pedal. Certainly not getting any eyeball popping. My Fiesta has much greater descelleration.

Interesting comment about long travel and spongey feel being engineered into the system! It's funny how all the bits we don't like, were specifically put there by Maserati
- Lazy gearbox
- detuned engine
- softer suspension
- ride height
- "quiet" exhaust

And to get what we want you have to get additional DBW, ECUs etc which all seems so unnecessary, if only Maserati provided the right buttons in the first place.... rather than eventually releasing a model wih the bells and whistles. (eg GTS /Stradale etc)

It's all software these days

Eb

BTW toying with the idea of a Formula dynamics DBW for Christmas - They will be having a sale around Thanksgiving. But perhaps I should spend the cash on being able to stop first!

 

[voicey]

I would start with the simple stuff and flush the brake fluid out. I am seeing more and more cars where this critical part of the annual maintenance has been skipped.

Here's some pictures of the fluid I took out of a Ferrari 360 last week. It had a full main dealer history....

 

[zagatoes30]

It surprises me how many drivers never check or change the brake fluid, given its the key component between the brake pedal and the pads its madness not to maintain it properly.

 

[Gp79]

I would start with the simple stuff and flush the brake fluid out. I am seeing more and more cars where this critical part of the annual maintenance has been skipped.

Here's some pictures of the fluid I took out of a Ferrari 360 last week. It had a full main dealer history....

My GS had similar looking fluid when i replaced it, again full service history...

The pedal did feel much better with the new fluid, my BMW specifies change of fluid every 2 years which is probably more realistic than annually on the maser, i.e it has more chance of actually being done!

 

[Ebenezer]

I assume brake fluid should be ok since it had a full service over the summer?
Eb

 

[Mr.Cambio]

Having FD lines on, Jeff suggested to use Motul fluid. I had two changes of it, but i still had fading when braking hard and several times. Then my engineer suggested to use ferodo, which is night and day. No fade anymore.
Brake fluid is very critical.

4200 brakes are good. They are not perfect and most important they are not impressive. Which means they are capable but do not give the driver the equal confidence. but still do the job.

Taking about my brakes:fd lines, 550 discs, ebc red or fd.

If you ask me if i would do any other upgrade? i would say yes. There is a spare set of 356mm AP brakes. That would be the ultimate solution.

 

[2b1ask1]

I assume brake fluid should be ok since it had a full service over the summer?
Eb

Well I do all my own brakes and know it is done... I am sorry but sceptical MD's don't do what they say they do in my experience. Even with safety critics stuff like brake juice!

 

[Ebenezer]

Hopefully my Indy wouldn't be so conniving....!
I'll take another look at the paperwork but I do seem to recall they said they'd replaced all fluids as it was a 4 year big service but without the replacement of the lambda sensors (ref the other thread) which they also said if it aint broke don't worry about replacement.

Where can one go to try these things out, a la Top Gear - Drag race, 0-60, braking distance etc... Surely these are the sorts of activities that boys (and girls) with their toys would like to engage in (safely of course)?

Eb
Eb

 

[Steve GS]

It's something I'd like to know on my car. At different speeds. And also doing a test with a car that's just had a break fluid change to one with old fluid. I'm sure would be some interesting readings.

 

[Ebenezer]

So looked back through the paper work - Apparently Front and rear brakes were stripped cleaned and lubed. Brake fluid changed- Tutela Extreme HT.
So I think that there's nowt wrong with the service and I probably just need to start budgetting for a full set of disk and pads.
Eb

 

[Contigo]

Yep go for a proper fast road pad. I would go with EBC Yellow Stuff or Ferodo DS2500's.