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Replaced Mas Granturismo S with 991 911 Turbo - first thoughts
- Thread starter smg800
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Haha yes indeed Craig, I wasn't expecting any universal acclaim by any stretch of the imagination!
It is indeed a Maserati forum, full of Maserati owners, and I know Maserati owners are really passionate about all that the Maserati means, in terms of flair, exotica, theatre and so on - not the first words you'd associate with a Porsche! I have been a Maserati man for a good few years now and I was initially actually going to stay Italian and get a 458, the driveway situation ruled it out unfortunately, but the 991 really has been a pleasant surprise.
Whilst of course these things are subjective, a couple of the comments have thrown me a little bit:
- Using a Maserati Gransport or GTS versus a BMW 3 series diesel as a comparison of Italian cars versus German cars is akin to using a Ghibli Diesel versus a C63 AMG as a comparison of German cars versus Italians. Clearly a Ghibli isn't representative of the finest Italian engineering in the same way a 3 series diesel isn't representative of a German drivers car....
- The engine one is just odd, I don't know of a huge amount of people who regularly look at their engine, or indeed use the appearance of the engine as part of their car buying criteria. Perhaps I am in the minority here though, I know it is very much "each to their own". I can indeed confirm there isn't much/any Porsche engine to look at, but I have seen as much of it as I have seen my previous Maserati ones
- Thankfully I have no children and no passengers to transport, the car is just for a bit of weekend driving. The usable rear seats in the Maserati are definitely a huge plus if that is part of the buyers criteria, without doubt. Struggling to see beyond the Maserati GTS, the Ferrari FF and the Aston Martin Rapide as "supercars" with usable rear seats so the GTS is in good company!
Anyhow, thanks for all the comments chaps, much appreciated and it is good hearing so many peoples perspective!
ChrisQP09
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Fair comment. Its the occasion most people buy into Maserati and I suspect the OP has grown out of it and into something more "practical and capable". As a Maserati owner, I like waking up to the prospect that I may not make it to work. Getting into my CLS 55 on the other hand I know it's going to get me out of bed if need be.
This definitely comes down to what you define as special and progression. I would agree that if I was judging my car by how many people are going to take photos of it, the Porsche is a step back, 100%. If judging it by speed, handling, usability, tech etc then it is a massive step up, and these were the motivating factors that led to the move. I did also have to be conscious of whatever I bought being sat on my driveway so I quite like the fact it is a bit more under the radar than a Gallardo, 458, McLaren etc. My mate with the 12c dropped by the other day and in the 30 minutes his car was on the drive 3 separate lots of people (including the bin men who temporarily stopped working to get some photos.....) were on the drive taking pictures with the car! No what I would want with my car on the drive, and not what I will get with the 911.
It is also my first ever brand new car which has felt quite special. Going from a used 40 odd grand Maserati to a brand new 120k Porsche definitely feels like progression and a step up the ladder, but I appreciate this is intrinsic, as opposed to people stopping you for a chat/filming you/taking photos etc.
Wattie
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This thread is a little bizarre.
It's full of car holics who all like different things.
On the one hand is a brand that is flawed, but when it works has an engine and history that stirs the soul- unfortunately its dynamically and technologically challenged in reliability terms.
On the other hand is a brand that has perhaps lost some of its soul to followers, but is dynamic an technologically advanced with a reliability that many crave.
To each his own. Many crave.
Cheers Wattie
It's full of car holics who all like different things.
On the one hand is a brand that is flawed, but when it works has an engine and history that stirs the soul- unfortunately its dynamically and technologically challenged in reliability terms.
On the other hand is a brand that has perhaps lost some of its soul to followers, but is dynamic an technologically advanced with a reliability that many crave.
To each his own. Many crave.
Cheers Wattie
Hahaha, if you like this Chris then you should try the McLaren too. Not only does it get stopped for photos and conversations constantly, but 1 week into his ownership of it (bought from McLaren, serviced before driving it away) he has had to have the car recovered as it has pretty much stopped working! As it happens they have given him a CLS whilst they try and fix it.....
ChrisQP09
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I rather like the new 570, not a fan of the 12c.
I get you 100% bro, just out of interest what are the residuals like on the 997? I have seen your colour in the flesh and I thought I needed sunglasses, really nice.
Well Porsche GMFV is £60k after 3 years, however clearly this is quite a bit off if you look at what £60k gets you on the used Porsche market. Mine is the 991, 3-5 year old 997 turbos on autotrader are around £70k-£90k dependent on mileage, spec etc and had a lower starting point price wise so I was working on the basis that it would be similar. I am fine with this, would be a bit wounded if it was the £60k though!
ChrisQP09
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Well your's looks like a good spec so should hold up especially as most if not miles will be weekends.
mjheathcote
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I think you will find £60K to be about right. Don't forget if you get £60K, the dealer will then be selling it for £70K, the price you see advertised.
A good friend has just sold his 997 Turbo, only 11K miles and immaculate, and cleared £50K.
Everyone I know who has bought a Porsche from a dealer, new or secondhand, has been shocked at the (low) residuals.
But why be surprised? Look at the dealership premises, the overheads, it has to be paid for!
I just couldn't buy a new one, for the first 3 years its depreciating between £1.5 to 2K a month, frightening!
rockits
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I am sure the 911 is a very capable car. I have had just as fast and slower but faster than my Maser. I've had a 987 Boxster 3.2 S as my only Porker but it never felt quick or special. I have spent maybe a 5 year journey through various different cars to get to my Maser. It was the right choice. I wanted something special, with character, not German & clinical. Also something that wasn't too good that it allows the driver to get the best out of it. Any numpty can drive these new bread of Supercars well and fast. You can't do that in 4200. There is a big difference between it driven well & badly & it rewards good driving & punishes bad driving.
I love looking at it in the garage with the cover on not in use. I love it when the cover is off & not in use. I love it when I drive it even more. When I viewed the car before buying I opened the bonnet, my jaw dropped & I stood there admiring like an idiot/child for 10 mins. Not many cars can do that especially at my budget. That says it all to me and hits to spot bang on.
Each to their own & all are different & want different things. I don't lust or desire one of these new bread of dare I say it ...boring supercars. What's the point on the public roads, they are too quick and not very involving unless at silly speeds.
I love looking at it in the garage with the cover on not in use. I love it when the cover is off & not in use. I love it when I drive it even more. When I viewed the car before buying I opened the bonnet, my jaw dropped & I stood there admiring like an idiot/child for 10 mins. Not many cars can do that especially at my budget. That says it all to me and hits to spot bang on.
Each to their own & all are different & want different things. I don't lust or desire one of these new bread of dare I say it ...boring supercars. What's the point on the public roads, they are too quick and not very involving unless at silly speeds.
CraigNicol123
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I agree with this. One of my mates is looking to upgrade his Lamborghini Aventador Roaster to a Roadster SV 'because it has 740bhp, 50bhp more than the standard roadster' but really what is the need, its not like that extra power is going to be of any benefit, especially on uk roads, unless at completely ridiculous, jail time, speed!
c4sman
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Very interesting thread. I still love my Porsche for what it does and I still love my Maserati for what it does. My view having a current foot in both camps and previously owning 2 997 turbos....
I initially ran a 997 Turbo alongside my GT-S and the turbo thrilled in a way the GT-S couldn't hope to for speed and handling, but did not have the noise or drama of the GT-S. The big problem was that I could only really enjoy the turbo 1% of the time. In its real operating zone, you are traveling at insane speeds. Assuming you are outside of urban areas which I do not travel quickly in, I would say my turbo needed to be 50-100% above the relevant speed limit to get up on it's toes and make me smile using the available cornering grip and braking. This is something that just doesn't work on the public road (at least in the South East). Regarding the straight line acceleration, this always impressed my passengers, but I got a bit bored with it.
I don't need to describe my current GT-S MC-Shift as many on here have already done so better than I, but it is enjoyable at 50% of the speed limit, so I have fun much more of the time.
My current 997 GTS manual is an interesting blend as it is more capable of thrashing around than the GT-S, but you can enjoy it closer to the legal limit than my Turbos, makes a pretty decent noise with high rev thrills not available in my Turbos and more feelsome steering, gearbox and RWD challenges, it also has it's flaws which add character. You also get to rev it out in a few gears and end up close to the national speed limit as opposed to still being in 1st gear.
The 991 Turbo is a stunning, stunning, staggering car, and congrats on the purchase, but please, please be careful with you licence when you are enjoying it!
I initially ran a 997 Turbo alongside my GT-S and the turbo thrilled in a way the GT-S couldn't hope to for speed and handling, but did not have the noise or drama of the GT-S. The big problem was that I could only really enjoy the turbo 1% of the time. In its real operating zone, you are traveling at insane speeds. Assuming you are outside of urban areas which I do not travel quickly in, I would say my turbo needed to be 50-100% above the relevant speed limit to get up on it's toes and make me smile using the available cornering grip and braking. This is something that just doesn't work on the public road (at least in the South East). Regarding the straight line acceleration, this always impressed my passengers, but I got a bit bored with it.
I don't need to describe my current GT-S MC-Shift as many on here have already done so better than I, but it is enjoyable at 50% of the speed limit, so I have fun much more of the time.
My current 997 GTS manual is an interesting blend as it is more capable of thrashing around than the GT-S, but you can enjoy it closer to the legal limit than my Turbos, makes a pretty decent noise with high rev thrills not available in my Turbos and more feelsome steering, gearbox and RWD challenges, it also has it's flaws which add character. You also get to rev it out in a few gears and end up close to the national speed limit as opposed to still being in 1st gear.
The 991 Turbo is a stunning, stunning, staggering car, and congrats on the purchase, but please, please be careful with you licence when you are enjoying it!
Maser Sod
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Well said! I am amazed at how easily people will give up a few grand for the convenience of a trade-in.
Great post, thanks for this! Really good points, hard to disagree with any of it.
Will the novelty of the acceleration and the fact there is a limit to what % of the capability of the car one can actually use wear off? Maybe! I am only a week in after all, and this is car number 8 in 4 years. Will be back cap in hand if this happens haha.
BJL
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I really respect my Porsche but can't see me ever loving it. The shut lines are perfect, the trim still fits and looks brand new, the performance is very impressive and reliability has been beyond reproach.
My QP is gorgeous, I go out to the garage and find myself taking pictures of it........after 8 years.....sad or what but that is maser ownership. It is beyond how well a car is made and goes.
My QP is gorgeous, I go out to the garage and find myself taking pictures of it........after 8 years.....sad or what but that is maser ownership. It is beyond how well a car is made and goes.
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Plus, I bet there isn't a Porsche forum on the planet which can hold a candle to SM.