Engine oil level increasing

[Dutch_Cerbera]

What's the advisable time to change the timing chains?

If I remember correctly, every 80,000 KM the chains and every 40,000 km the belt

 

[Dutch_Cerbera]

By the way, overfilled oil is not a bad thing on the ghibli. The Cup Race cars were overfilled by the best part of a litre to reduce oil surge issues. We have run our track ghibli overfilled for about 8 years.

I thought overfilling could damage the catalytic converter. But I guess you removed the cats for your track Ghibli, so not problem in your case.
Or am I wrong?

 

[safrane]

There is a Maserati refurbished engine at Meridian Modena in Lyndhurst advertised on Pistonheads parts section. No price but been for sale for an age.

 

[jluis]

Depending on your level of skill, tools, or the availability of a friendly workshop, I would take that engine out and strip it to bits to find out what is worn.

You can then budget the cost to repair it and compare that cost with a used engine or a refurbished one.

A used engine is a shot in the dark and a refurbished one will depend a lot on who did the refurbishment and what is the warranty given.

If you overhaul your engine at least you will know it's properly done.

 

[spacecadet]

Thanks everybody for the help so far!

IMO, the lack of compression is more likely to be valves or, more likely, head gasket if you can feel compression coming out through the dipstick. Just a thought.

I thought if it's the head gasket, it would come out e.g. at the cooling water expansion tank.

There is a Maserati refurbished engine at Meridian Modena in Lyndhurst advertised on Pistonheads parts section. No price but been for sale for an age.

Couldn't find it, but thanks for the tip, I keep it in mind.

Depending on your level of skill, tools, or the availability of a friendly workshop, I would take that engine out and strip it to bits to find out what is worn.

You can then budget the cost to repair it and compare that cost with a used engine or a refurbished one.

A used engine is a shot in the dark and a refurbished one will depend a lot on who did the refurbishment and what is the warranty given.

If you overhaul your engine at least you will know it's properly done.

These are my exact thoughts too. The workshop said they can do this, at least they worked on some of these engines so far. Will post updates then.

 

[jluis]

If you are inclined to a major overhaul, I suggest getting the service manual for the engine.
I have it for the 3200 and it goes to great detail on the items that need to checked (clearances, etc) and all the adjustments that need to be done.
For the 3200 there is an entire chapter dedicated to engine overhaul, I suppose it's the same for your engine.

These engines are not rocket science and a good woorkshop with the service manual can do it easily.

 

[safrane]

Engine

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifi...ri/maserati-4-2-gransport-engine--used/285091

 

[Gp79]

Is the only issue oil level increasing and the odd cel?

If so I find it hard to believe it needs complete rebuild, normal signs of sha99ed engine would be it to run terrible, no power, consume oil, oil blown out of breather, blue smoke etc etc

 

[spacecadet]

Sorry for the long silence, things are moving a bit slowly in this area right now.

I was able to source the only available workshop manual for the V6 - 24 valve engines (part no. 910010005, see http://www.maserati-alfieri.co.uk/trident10.htm). It's for the QP engines (AM573) but in theory it also works for the Ghibli engine (AM496). Anyone knows about the differences between these engines?

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifi...ri/maserati-4-2-gransport-engine--used/285091

Oh, it's a GS engine, won't work, but thanks anyway.

Is the only issue oil level increasing and the odd cel?

I also noticed that the car became weaker. I hope there won't be so big issues as most of you wrote, but I'm expecting the worst now, so it only can get better

 

[spacecadet]

Some news.

I've talked to an engine specialist and he is on the same opinion like some of you that it's a fueling issue. Even if we rebuild the engine this should be solved before trashing the new engine.

First I ordered some new NTK OTD3G-3A1 lambda sensors because I don't think they were ever changed. I didn't measure them, but after so many kms they should be slow and off.

Then I measured both the intake air temp (Maserati 470079800) and the coolant temp sensors (Maserati 470079700) and they are definitely wrong, measuring around 10 degrees of C instead of 25. They are Magneti Marelli ATS04 and WTS05 sensors, available in their current lineup but cannot really find a place where it's available. Only found substitutions from the Italian company Facet. Anyone used their parts? Are they reliable?

Also while lurking around the intake manifold I found a broken vacuum pipe union connected to the fuel EVAP system. I guess this causes vacuum or boost leak, the later leading to a rich mixture? Can it be that the fuel odours I can smell lately are because of the carbon canister always full and never emptied into the intake manifold? My problem is that I cannot find a replacement part for this, it's part no. 578064500 substituted by 585064500 but they are listed on crazy 160 and 45 GBP prices on Eurospares. Can anyone recommend a substitution for this?

 

[del mar]

I damaged a couple of mine removing them.

I bought some Brass 3200GT ones from David Askew - £30 I think.

There are 3 or 4 of these coming out the back of the manifold. You could always blank this off and then "T" into one of the other hoses to connect into.

Del

 

[spacecadet]

Thanks, I will ask him.
Yeah I was also thinking about something like that. In case of the fuel regulator too, if it ever needs to be change, there are much more options with a single inlet.

 

[Wack61]

I would take an oil sample and send it off for analysis (search web for companies)

If anyone is looking for oil analysis millers do it for £30 and £40 for multiple tests including a kit for taking the samples

http://www.millersoils.co.uk/automotive/millercare.asp

 

[spacecadet]

Finally I have all the parts, bits and pieces, got 3 brass unions from David Askew. Thanks for the tip Del!

I'll remove and open the inlet manifold during the weekend to remove the broken union. Few questions before that:
- Is there anything I should be prepared for or take caution about (fragile gaskets, etc.)?
- Do these unions have to be sealed with something so air doesn't leak between aluminium and brass? Asking because I there are traces of some clear substance on the used brass ones I got.
- Also is there a recommendation for the torque of the inlet manifold screws? Couldn't find any in the workshop manual.

 

[spacecadet]

One more thing, I also removed the injectors and sent them off for inspection. They were cleaned, measured, one or two was a bit stuck, but all are in factory range now. The o-rings doesn't look brittle, but I ordered an overhaul kit from Mr Injector just in case. Should I replace the o-rings? I guess pintle caps can stay if they are not broken.

 

[spacecadet]

Meanwhile I've found the torque specs for the intake manifold allen screws in the Biturbo workshop manual. It's 25.5 Nm, quite sure it's the same for the Ghibli.

 

[del mar]

You will need 6 "o" ring gaskets for the manifold when you put it back on, you will need to put a "dab of grease" or similar on them to stop them falling out when you put it back on. There are some hard to see pipes at the back of the manifold so be careful when you try to pull it off.

I didn't seal mine with anything.

I don't think Maserati have any of the injector "o" rings left - Bill McGrath have some.

 

[spacecadet]

Indeed there was a bigger pipe in the lower-left corner I didn't see... only after trying to pull it off. It was quite hard to remove and this action caused some small peeling paint / dirt to fall into the intake ports. Luckily only the 2 back pistons were open, so duct-taped a straw to a vac and sucked everything out I could. Lesson learned, blow everything away with compressed air.

In the end I've used Loctite 577 for sealing the threads, also for sealing the coolant temp sensor.

For the o-rings I've used this set: http://mrinjectoruk.co.uk/Weber-IW-...-Filters-Pintel-caps-6-cylinder-P3212676.aspx

Spent quite some time on the weekend to clean up the manifold, remove all the loose paint, etc. Will repaint later when the engine is apart. Hopefully I'll put back everything tonight.

 

[Contigo]

Indeed there was a bigger pipe in the lower-left corner I didn't see... only after trying to pull it off. It was quite hard to remove and this action caused some small peeling paint / dirt to fall into the intake ports. Luckily only the 2 back pistons were open, so duct-taped a straw to a vac and sucked everything out I could. Lesson learned, blow everything away with compressed air.

In the end I've used Loctite 577 for sealing the threads, also for sealing the coolant temp sensor.

For the o-rings I've used this set: http://mrinjectoruk.co.uk/Weber-IW-...-Filters-Pintel-caps-6-cylinder-P3212676.aspx

Spent quite some time on the weekend to clean up the manifold, remove all the loose paint, etc. Will repaint later when the engine is apart. Hopefully I'll put back everything tonight.

Just did the manifold removal on Project 3200. Take your time and make sure to order some replacement bolts as they just rust. I went for some black rust proof bolts and they seem to do the job. I did the starter replacement which even for my limited mechanical ability was quite easy with the right tools and excellent forum guide.

 

[spacecadet]

Just did the manifold removal on Project 3200. Take your time and make sure to order some replacement bolts as they just rust. I went for some black rust proof bolts and they seem to do the job. I did the starter replacement which even for my limited mechanical ability was quite easy with the right tools and excellent forum guide.

Forunately my bolts were in a pretty nice condition. I thought I can skip the bolt store, of course i dropped the last fuel rail bolt (just after the thought "lets be careful with this, don't drop it) and the car immediately ate it.

Already had a short test drive, I really hope the issue will be solved, will find out after a few hundred kms.

Thanks for the help so far.