Brexit Deal

Nibby

Member
Messages
2,090
To do what? To help with immigration when we didn't implement the rules that would have addressed the issue?
It's not 'we' as I pointed out earlier it was the government and because they ignored people's concerns people voted Leave which they hope will address that problem. Didn't the penny drop when that vile chancer Nick Griffin started getting his mug everywhere?
It's people like Blair you should vent your spleen at for ignoring people, people like him and Merkel have made a breeding ground for the far-right.
 

TridentTested

Member
Messages
1,819
The majority of this county want out of the EU

That is no longer the case. YouGov (one of the respected pollsters) poll this morning is 62% Remain, 38% Leave.

If it was still hovering around the 50:50, I might agree with you (I would still argue the lies, illegal activity and foreign interference should void the 23rd June result, and a second confirmation check should be run) but 62:38 is unambiguous.

It's "the will of the people" no longer holds water. Indeed, it is more and more clear that the will of the people is to Remain.

To Leave in the face of that will would be unjust, and not British.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
Why can't they just get a Visa as in other countries?

They can. Have you ever filled out a visa application?
However, in the hospitality industry everyone moves about. A lot! So having to fill out a visa application and wait for it to be granted is a ball ache at best.
 

midlifecrisis

Member
Messages
16,229
The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland was created in 1801 so it depends which canal you were talking about ;)

Bridgewater canal was late 18th Century, not sure if the navvies worked on that one, but the Manchester Canal was 19th Century and they definitely worked on that. Anyway I consider myself an immigrant, the Southerners need a Northerner to help maintain their navaids...
 

Oneball

Member
Messages
11,122
Wasn't it something like that predicted before the actual referendum?

I don’t think it was ever that clear cut.

However I’m not sure I believe the current polls are accurate. Much as I’d like to see a second referendum and us vote to stay I don’t know a single person on either side who has changed their mind.
 

TridentTested

Member
Messages
1,819
To further complicate things, the CTA isn't a legal Act or Treaty, it's more an informal arrangement. To withdraw it would cause outrage, as it's estimated that there's up to 40% crossover wrt to British/Irish family relationships. I can't imagine the EU has even considered this, given it's not in any statute book, and most likely why UK and Ireland joined the EU at exactly the same time (thanks TridentTested).

To further complicate things there are actually more British living in Ireland, than Irish living in Britain - when you look at it in percentage terms. So anything which hurts the CTA will hurt a greater number of Irish living in Britain but will also hurt a higher percentage of British living in Ireland.

The CTA came into existence because one hundred years ago (exactly) Ireland was separating from England and the negotiators at the time already understood that the citizens of both countries were complicatedly intertwined. To have insisted on visas and residency permits would have been chaotic and cut deeply across both countries. Don't forget a large proportion of the British in Ireland at the time were the land-owning class, they didn't want this disruption to their lives; they had influence in Westminster and shaped the settlement.

It seems to me that this successful example - and let's face it, it has been successful, it endured even through the worst years of the civil war we call the Troubles - should have been followed for the EU26 (27 minus Ireland) rights. It was promised by the Leave campaign that their rights "would continue exactly as before". This hasn't happened, and is shameful. A hundred years ago Ireland and England were locked in violence and we still managed to reach an honourable settlement. It's such a shame this lesson has been forgotten.

As to what happens to the CTA now. Who knows. Imagine you are doing business in Belfast, if the person you are contracting with identifies as Irish they have the right to the ECJ, if they identify as British they don't. It is going to be a legal mess for decades. If we have any international law barristers on the forum, time to start specialising in this area, it is going to be very lucrative.

Ending red tape? - kiss my royal Irish ar5e. (Kiss my RIA was a common expression in Dublin a hundred years ago).
 

Wanderer

Member
Messages
5,791
Well looks like I'm working in Spain next week so its not all looking bad.
I just landed some work in fecking NL, I don't want it, rate is pants and whilst NL has the 30% tax allowance tech people, I fear it still might not make me much. Still it's contribution, keeps the bank ticking over. Waiting on RBS in Edinburgh but I'd pinned my hopes on follow-up work at HSBC, that's gone mammaries uppermost it seems....
 

TridentTested

Member
Messages
1,819
Well looks like I'm working in Spain next week so its not all looking bad.

This is what's misunderstood about FoM. It's not just the right to move to France and become resident there, but also to drive to Spain to do a short contract there. There are many Brits living in small countries like Luxembourg and Belgium - who currently travel all over Europe with their work - who are going to be land-locked after Brexit. They will be unemployable.

Post-Brexit, unless you can quickly get French nationality, I don't have much optimism for your position. Why would your employer deal with the hassle of getting a Spanish visa and work permit for you when he can send a French employee more easily?
 

Wanderer

Member
Messages
5,791
No it’s a Kingdom in its own right as are Scotland and England

Wales is a Principality a bit like Monaco but with less yachts and more rain.

From the 100% accurate Wikipedia...

"The Kingdom of Ireland was a client state of England and then of Great Britain that existed from 1542 until 1800.

It was ruled by the monarchs of England and then of Great Britain in Personal Union with their other realms."

I thought I'd read Britain/England had rules over Ireland for 800 years prior to 1922.....

Still going for the Pedantcy of SM......
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,631
I don’t think it was ever that clear cut.

However I’m not sure I believe the current polls are accurate. Much as I’d like to see a second referendum and us vote to stay I don’t know a single person on either side who has changed their mind.

Found this, if my maths is correct it was 55% remain 45% leave over the 2 polls average carrying the 10% ties:

laurencechartyougov.png
 

midlifecrisis

Member
Messages
16,229
From the 100% accurate Wikipedia...

"The Kingdom of Ireland was a client state of England and then of Great Britain that existed from 1542 until 1800.

It was ruled by the monarchs of England and then of Great Britain in Personal Union with their other realms."

I thought I'd read Britain/England had rules over Ireland for 800 years prior to 1922.....

Still going for the Pedantcy of SM......
What exactly is a 'client' state?

Did we send them an invoice?