Which is the true way forward Hydrogen cell or EV

[Swedish Paul]

Hydrogen has to be gathered/extracted via green energy or it is just another mockery. As I understand it the big sticking point seems to be well: This

An easy read explaining it better than I could.

I really hope they crack this soon as it is IMHO a far better outcome than pure EV by lithium batteries.

Of course, they just mine electricity straight out the ground with no processing required

 

[lozcb]

Any whizzes out there that know how to turn hydrogen gas into liquid hydrogen we can store into LPG cylinders ..................this is the way i think we should be looking at .................................

Making hydrogen at home isn't tricky at all, storing it in a usable form is, liquifying it is the real trick. Cooling it to below 33K (yes, -253C) takes a bit more than a home freezer. Household boilers are easy, the gas network will be slowly converted to hydrogen and all boilers made after '96 can burn up to 23% gas hydrogen mix. But house boiler tend only to be around 15kW instantaneous power, so gaseous hydrogen has the energy density to deal with this. Cars need a lot more power (especially the ones we like) so liquid hydrogen is the only way, and thats very hard to do.
[/QUOTE]

mass manufacture these and possibly we could be in business.................maybe

 

[MRichards]

I agree that EV's will go down in history as a technological blind alley similarly to the steam powered vehicles.
Our local council has two Toyota hydrogen cars which look rather better styled that your usual bar-of-soap on wheels Toyota. The hydrogen is stored in two high pressure plastic cylinders under the back seats so it's not cutting edge technology. Japanese hydrogen powered cars are available from the showroom floor in the USA. We in Australia have examples being trialled in small numbers. The major problem is the lack of service stations dispensing hydrogen. Once we have the filling stations,these cars could become popular.
Oil refineries are the major source of hydrogen as a lot is produced by cracking of crude oil in the refinery. I believe the oil industry could easily supply all the hydrogen if these cars become popular.
Personally,I would pass up the chance to own an EV. I'm saving my money for a fuel cell car using hydrogen.
Recently Tasmania has seed-funded a project to use hydrogen as the state's major fuel with A$50 million. This state currently generates electricity by hydro and sells the excess to other Australian states,so,when hydrogen becomes a reality they will be totally green.

 

[lozcb]

Germany preparing , this is what we should be doing in the UK instead of HS2 remember you heard it hear first guys , How long will it be before Elon Musk changes tack

https://www.rechargenews.com/transi...-for-world-s-largest-hydrogen-grid/2-1-810731

 

[DaveT]

Hydrogen is the long term answer - at least in terms of the alternatives we know about right now.

 

[rossyl]

Shell opened the UK's first consumer HYRDROGEN refuelling station in 2017

3 YEARS AGO!

But, if the car manufacturers don't back it, then what can you do? It was thought to be the start of a shift to hydrogen cars.



For trucks, in the US an entire area, busy with hauling cargo, has had LNG Truck fuelling stations built.

The low environmental damage energy is being made available by the energy companies. Governments and car manufacturers don't seem interested.


EV in my opinion is just moving the issues to other countries, and creating significant battery waste.

 

[rossyl]

LNG (liquidised natural gas) is the answer for heavy vehicles that require diesel engines (trucks, lorries, barges, vessels).

I cannot fathom why electric heavy engines are even being considered. They'll be too inefficient.

 

[conaero]

You can also retro fit it to existing 4 stroke engines...and there, may be your issue.

I vote for HFC and agree EV is a short term answer to a greater problem. Companies have invested in it so they want their pound of flesh/return before moving on.

 

[GeoffCapes]

Shell opened the UK's first consumer HYRDROGEN refuelling station in 2017

3 YEARS AGO!

But, if the car manufacturers don't back it, then what can you do? It was thought to be the start of a shift to hydrogen cars.



For trucks, in the US an entire area, busy with hauling cargo, has had LNG Truck fuelling stations built.

The low environmental damage energy is being made available by the energy companies. Governments and car manufacturers don't seem interested.


EV in my opinion is just moving the issues to other countries, and creating significant battery waste.

Is that purely Hydrogen? Because I'm 99% sure there was a hydrogen pump at the BP near where I use to live in Brentwood and that was 10 years ago.
I seem to recall a bloke down the road having a hydrogen BMW 7 series.

 

[rossyl]

Is that purely Hydrogen? Because I'm 99% sure there was a hydrogen pump at the BP near where I use to live in Brentwood and that was 10 years ago.
I seem to recall a bloke down the road having a hydrogen BMW 7 series.

You might be right.

It's Shell in collaboration with a UK based company that have put these up: https://www.itm-power.com/h2-stations

 

[GeoffCapes]

You might be right.

It's Shell in collaboration with a UK based company that have put these up: https://www.itm-power.com/h2-stations

According to the BP website they opened their first hydrogen pump in 2007.

 

[foibles]

I believe regular wheel alignments are the only true way forward...

And now for something completely different...

john cadogan hydrogen - Google Search

www.google.com

 

[lozcb]

I believe regular wheel alignments are the only true way forward...

And now for something completely different...

john cadogan hydrogen - Google Search

www.google.com

What an absolute diick , his whole argument is based on the old traditional method of producing hydrogen which isnt the way forward because it produces CO2 elsewhere along the chain (He probably has avenues in EV vehicles along the line sometwhere,) Hydrogen produced from electrolysis as far as im aware emits no co2 just hydrogen and oxygen ...................but it needs electricity from somewhere , perhaps wind or solar or hydropower , am i missing something here .......................................................

 

[outrun]

I think you should all invest in microNuclear. 1,000,000 mile range and encapsulated in a concrete cassette. What could possibly go wrong...

Mr Fusion.

Just ask Marty and the Doc.

 

[daverichardson]

Hydrogen for me.
James May did a piece in an old Top Gear program and it was very good even then - years ago
Think the big companies dictate where we go

 

[midlifecrisis]

Long haul would require a long range and quick replenishment of that range, and presently EV cannot achieve that.
The future would be a combination of hydrogen for the long haul and EV for cities.

 

[spkennyuk]

Mr Fusion.

Just ask Marty and the Doc.

Now if we can just couple that to a flux capacitor. We could stop lead ever being added to petrol and stop the idea of the 2000's to push diesel as the future fuel for company cars.

 

[outrun]

Now if we can just couple that to a flux capacitor. We could stop lead ever being added to petrol and stop the idea of the 2000's to push diesel as the future fuel for company cars.

Just don’t ever use that Mr Fusion equipped Alfa 166 of yours to jump to 2020!

 

[spkennyuk]

Just don’t ever use that Mr Fusion equipped Alfa 166 of yours to jump to 2020!

Ahh the 166 flying machine i think it could manage 88 mph from it 2 litre twin spark engine.

 

[allandwf]

I don't think electric , in this application, will ever truly take off. The generation, storage, etc. are all so much against what it purports to be in favour of.