Wack61
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I used to be on the stall next to Andy's records Saturdays 1976-80 ish,that seems like a lifetime ago now lived in Kettering,
My car priorities must change
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Wack61
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It's not a personal choice for most of the population who can't afford the fees, people that have never had to survive on £250 a week have no idea how most of the population budgets their income, there's certainly nothing left for private education for most families
while a private education might not guarantee anything it certainly puts you 3/4 up the ladder if 80% of the students at oxbridge come from 8 private schools.
Funnily enough this very debate has just been on the jeremy vine show , some woman just couldn't grasp why people were so against private schools when everybody has the opportunity to go
Was it a tv show where MPs had to live on benefits for a week and most were spent up by Tuesday morning
Nibby
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I must of walked past you a few times then, still got my Spanish pressing in yellow vinyl of Stranger In Town, Bob Seger I bought off there, circa 79.
Small world
Wanderer
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Navcorr
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Does this no longer automatically qualify for a seat on the board?....until I start to dribble or foam at the mouth and have to be put down
CatmanV2
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Does this no longer automatically qualify for a seat on the board?
I thought it was mandatory for senior HR....
C
Wack61
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Masser50
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I’m not an idiot I assume if you are able to blow money on a Maserati you obviously have some choices, maybe not everything you want. Jeremy Vine a complete idiot.......
Our son born in 1984 went to a 300 pupil state primary - just like I and my wife did in the 50's (then grammar school leaving with only 5 or 6 'O' levels) - it was our nearest school and had a pretty good reputation. I had the opportunity to become a parent govenor and this really helped to get the inside knowledge of school. The head teacher was a lady of similar age to us who inspired confidence so we never considered looking at changing. We think the important thing was my wife decided to stay at home until he was 11 and we both took great interest in his school work and in the latter years his homework - he was never the top of the class. When the time came for senior school the headteacher suggested he should sit the entrance exam for 3 local public schools. He was offered scholarships at 2 of them ie reduced fees but the 3rd one was the best school - Merchant Taylors at Crosby. The fees per term in 1995 were c £600 (not boarding) and he enjoyed his time there. He did very well at GCSE and A levels and chose to read engineering. He was offered places at Lancaster, Bristol and Imperial, but on his own bat he applied for and got in at Peterhouse, Cambridge. He ended up with an Honours degree with distinction, and after 3rd year in the CCF Royal Navy at Merchants chose to become an RN officer via BRNC at Dartmouth. He is now a Lt Cdr and in charge of Nuclear Engineering on board HMS Talent.
I would suggest that having interested parents, careful investigation of suitable schools and having offspring who show signs of natural intelligence are the important things to look at just as much as school reputations (state or public)
I would suggest that having interested parents, careful investigation of suitable schools and having offspring who show signs of natural intelligence are the important things to look at just as much as school reputations (state or public)
I've tried hard with every foreign company I've resourced for, going back donkey's years, NOT to make a degree a prerequisite for admin / management or other non-technical roles. My nephew, who is fifteen and is a smart, well-adjusted cookie cannot wait to get out of the exceptionally academically good grammar school that he attends. Same as almost everyone else I ever knew, he wants to get out of Northern Ireland and travel as much as possible. I as 'bad uncle' but favourite uncle, will be encouraging him.
He seems to be genuinely interested in the Royal Navy. Maybe a short service commission or similar. Hopefully that has some technical or similar, transferable skills.
A Chicago Business School professor called Russell Ackoff, advocated for apprenticeships over MBAs and similar, for virtually his whole career I believe. He was one of the most respected organisational theorists of his generation.
Even Ackoff couldn't turn back the tide of the rise of MBA courses. I am very much in Ackoff's corner and my PhD in leadership psychology will end up advocating for everything he advocated for. Properly managed apprenticeships could be one means of not losing all the rare skills practised by lone men in sheds and small businesses. The people we turn to, to fix, replace or refurbish the car parts that aren't made any longer.
Because the British Open is on this week, about a mile from me. I'm meeting even more Americans than usual and they generally despair of their own politics and say wistfully how much they'd love to move to the UK or Ireland. I haven't the heart to tell them that the UK is just as screwed up as the US. Perhaps more so. Let them have their fantasies. It costs nothing.
I believe that the way our politicians are running our country is quite literally insane.
But, whats the alternative.
That's my rant over also. Apologies for the self indulgence
I remember my father saying if anyone had been in the Royal Navy you would always get a job outside because of the standards of discipline and skills learned. To get in as an officer you have to pass the Admiralty Interview Board and this was a 3 day test. But join as a seaman and you can progress up the ladder - if you have the ability and determination!
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I think that if your kids are happy at their school this really opens them up to learning. It's a risk to remove them from an environment that they are enjoying to one which they may find more difficult. Both of ours were academic and we could have (at a push) sent them to a private school. But because they were doing well, and we felt that the Head was really on top of all aspects of the school, they stayed and did very well. The confidence that they had in their own abilities helped them settle into secondary school with no hassles.
My son finished 6th form and decided he wanted to start working and now runs part of the family business, and my daughter has just finished uni coming out with a 1st in biomedical science.
One of the greatest things you can do to help your child is to show an interest in what they are doing, and perhaps more importantly, give them a head start, before they even get to school, by teaching them the sounds that letters make and how to write their name. It costs nothing, isn't difficult, but just needs time and a certain amount of perseverance.
My son finished 6th form and decided he wanted to start working and now runs part of the family business, and my daughter has just finished uni coming out with a 1st in biomedical science.
One of the greatest things you can do to help your child is to show an interest in what they are doing, and perhaps more importantly, give them a head start, before they even get to school, by teaching them the sounds that letters make and how to write their name. It costs nothing, isn't difficult, but just needs time and a certain amount of perseverance.
JonW
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Small world... I’m an ex Merchant Taylor’s boy, and I know for a fact that if my parents hadn’t “made’ me sit the exam when I was 11 there is no way I would have followed the path I followed or been anywhere near as successful.
When I was 11 I really didn’t want to go to the posh school. All my friends were going to one or other of the local state schools, and I got a little bit of ribbing / **** taking from my friends and local kids about the fact I was the odd one out. However, it was (for me) the best decision my parents ever made to make me sit the exam, and then when I was offered a place they heavily “encouraged” me to try it for a few years…
That’s not to say I wouldn’t have been successful or happy if I hadn’t gone there, but I am 100% certain that it was the fact I was mixing with boys with different ambitions which made me change my ambitions. The knowing I was bright enough to mix it with the best of them also helped at various stages of my life, as did the small chip on my shoulder I developed in terms of wanting to prove I was as good as the richer kids. Finally the social skills and confidence I learned there means I feel just as able to be at home in a working class pub in Liverpool or in much more posh high falutin environments.
I’m eternally grateful that my Mum and Dad made the decisions that they made, and I think that sending your kids to the best possible school you can is one of the best things you can do as a parent. However, I completely agree that this doesn’t always mean the most expensive, or the most academically focused...
rockits
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This is a key thing for me as well in being able to be comfortable with all levels of society whether it be royalty, the rich, toffs, academics, middle class, working class and everything above, below and in-between.
My dad was a plasterer by trade with a 6 year apprenticeship from 14 to 20. He grafted and was pretty sharp. I've pretty much done the same just having a slightly better start.
I spent much time on buildings sites and still do now. I'm most comfortable in a upper working class or lower middle class environment as my natural fit. However am still very comfortable in working class environments and fit in fine as well. I'm still very able and comfortable enough in middle, upper middle and upper class environments with little issue although it is not my natural fit.
To be able to bridge across all these environments and types of people I find a real advantage. One I am keen that my kids should be able to do as well.
My dad was a plasterer by trade with a 6 year apprenticeship from 14 to 20. He grafted and was pretty sharp. I've pretty much done the same just having a slightly better start.
I spent much time on buildings sites and still do now. I'm most comfortable in a upper working class or lower middle class environment as my natural fit. However am still very comfortable in working class environments and fit in fine as well. I'm still very able and comfortable enough in middle, upper middle and upper class environments with little issue although it is not my natural fit.
To be able to bridge across all these environments and types of people I find a real advantage. One I am keen that my kids should be able to do as well.
daverichardson
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Another problem is school selection has changed in my lifetime.
I went to the nearest state schools and they were ok. It was my catchment area
Nowadays Ofsted deem a school outstanding so parents send their kids there. It used to be from the catchment area but now it is from anywhere via taxis and personal cars. there are also knock on effects, a 'good'school pushes house prices up if we use the catchment area model and increases traffic congestion if we use the anywhere model. Schools themselves are becoming more powerful too. Ridiculous health and Safety rules (I can quote). Punishing parents with fines for holiday in term time (how did that come about?) etc. Constant exam pressure, homework for 6 year olds.
Better stop now
I went to the nearest state schools and they were ok. It was my catchment area
Nowadays Ofsted deem a school outstanding so parents send their kids there. It used to be from the catchment area but now it is from anywhere via taxis and personal cars. there are also knock on effects, a 'good'school pushes house prices up if we use the catchment area model and increases traffic congestion if we use the anywhere model. Schools themselves are becoming more powerful too. Ridiculous health and Safety rules (I can quote). Punishing parents with fines for holiday in term time (how did that come about?) etc. Constant exam pressure, homework for 6 year olds.
Better stop now
Hawk13
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This really is fascinating and I am surprised by how polarised some of the views are.
Although I agree with the above quote, this simply isn't how it works in the real world. The only people who are truly happy at school are the ones who don't give a sh1t. Everyone else is left grinding along at a pace that probably isn't right for them - leaving the academics bored and non-academics failing.
The benefit of private schools that I have seen (no one in my family ever has ever been) is the teacher pupil ratio and the ability to meet everyone's needs. That for me, is reason enough.
I was fortunate to attend a grammar school and to be able to move my kids to a good area with decent schools. If I hadn't and the money was available, I wouldn't think twice about paying out for my kids as I see education as as investment.
Nowadays, if you leave school with limited prospects at 18 you are facing down a 50 year + working life and getting by on a low wage isn't easy.