Grecale

keith

Member
Messages
638
I've had a 2010 XF 3.0 D for 4 years now with the 6 speed ZF and can't fault it.
I am always the first to admit when I’m wrong, and in this case.
I AM WRONG! Apologies, I am getting muddled between the 2010 3.0D S Portfolio I owned from new for five years, and the subsequent Ghibli Diesel which had the 8 speed.
 

Gazcw

Member
Messages
7,762
I am always the first to admit when I’m wrong, and in this case.
I AM WRONG! Apologies, I am getting muddled between the 2010 3.0D S Portfolio I owned from new for five years, and the subsequent Ghibli Diesel which had the 8 speed.
How many gears you got now Keith, Forward and Backward? :p
 

keith

Member
Messages
638
How many gears you got now Keith, Forward and Backward? :p
I'm guessing just a forward and reverse switch!
That said in getting on for four months I'm not missing gears, and I am enjoying the Rolls Royce like refinement in ride and quietness. It makes a change to come across a manufacturer who makes an unashamed luxury car. Also I don't miss spending in excess of £100 filling up, and enjoy driving into central London without paying Congestion Charge (until 2025 that is), and only paying a little over a Quid to park at a meter for its duration!
I know it's heresy on here to say but EV really is the way to go!!
 

safrane

Member
Messages
16,829
Good to see that the APR Maserati is charging is less than that from Porsche. So in real terms, even though the list price of the Grecale is slightly more than its equivalent Mecan, the monthly payments (as appropriate for the vast majority of buyers) will be less.
Do either deals cover maintenance and is the miles the same... always make me chuckle when the 'low price deal' is <6k miles per year!
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
Messages
9,037
Good to see that the APR Maserati is charging is less than that from Porsche. So in real terms, even though the list price of the Grecale is slightly more than its equivalent Mecan, the monthly payments (as appropriate for the vast majority of buyers) will be less.

Maybe they fiddle with the future value too.
I've always had a 'thing' over the BMW i8, and flirt from time to time on the BMW used car web site.
Noticed the other day you can't buy a used one from BMW with a finance rate less than 13%. but the payments where affordable. The future value was so high that over the term you where paying for so much credit, and not for the car itself.
 

MarkMas

Chief pedant
Messages
8,899
There's a review of the Grecale in The Telegraph this weekend. No great insights but a reasonable summary.

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The link has a paywall, and I'm not a subscriber (of course), but The Telegraph has pathetic tech, so the full text is below.

Maserati Grecale review: failure is not an option for this new hybrid family SUV

The marque's entry to a competitive market is tasked with adding dependability to desirability while still delivering on pace and handling

By Andrew English 27 May 2023

Tradition dictates that the debut of any new Maserati is like the promises of an unfaithful lover: this time it will be different, this time they will be good and trustworthy. They will start every morning and won’t break down, they promise, with apparent sincerity. Yet with this renowned old Italian marque, experience has shown that reality proves less than the sum of these promises.

I well remember a Maserati launch during which I heard a terrible thump, which was the driver’s-side window breaking loose and falling into the door bottom. Then it rained heavily.

But since January 2021, when Maserati – along with the basket of goods that was Fiat Chrysler Automobiles – became part of the Stellantis Group, promises have to be kept. Or else the mega-group’s boss of bosses, Carlos Tavares, will ease out the recalcitrant division manager, in this case Davide Grasso, on the toe of his boot; believe me, failure is not an option.

So, suddenly, in its 109th year, Alfieri Maserati’s firm, founded in Bologna but now headquartered down the road in Modena, has to make reliable cars as well as beautiful ones.

The marque’s famed trident badge, devised by Alfieri’s younger brother Mario after seeing the fontana di Nettuno (Neptune’s fountain) in the centre of the family’s home town of Bologna, will now stand not only for style, charismatic engines and fantastic performance, but also dependability.

What’s more, Maserati’s finances, so often convoluted and deeply unprofitable, are to be put on a sound footing. To that end, Maserati is following the market to deliver this, the Grecale, a smaller, family-sized and more affordable SUV, which follows in the footsteps of the Levante large SUV of a few years ago.

Can it be true? The renowned Italian purveyor of sports cars and gran turismos producing a family SUV to do battle with countless bland Volkswagen ID.4s, Volvo XC40s, BMW X4s, Jaguar F-Paces, Audi Q4s and, of course, the Porsche Macan. Really?

There are four versions, all arriving this year, starting with the £61,570 GT, which has a 296bhp/332lb ft 2.0-litre turbo engine with a belt-driven starter/generator mild hybrid system and an electric turbocharger to mitigate the lag before the turbo spins at its most efficient. It is capable of 149mph and 0-62mph in 5.6sec, with economy of 32.5mpg and CO2 emissions of 198g/km.

The £67,180 Modena tested here has a bit more power at 325bhp, the same 332lb ft of torque and top speed, but will accelerate to 62mph in 5.3sec, while delivering 32mpg and 199g/km.

The top model is the Trofeo, at the distinctly top price of £99,700. It has a 3.0-litre, twin-turbo V6 engine developing 523bhp/457lb ft. It’s capable of 177mph, with 0-62mph in 3.8sec, 16.2mpg and emitting 254g/km.

A battery electric model called the Folgore (Italian for thunderbolt) will arrive later in the year.

All models are four-wheel drive with a ZF eight-speed torque converter automatic gearbox. The top Trofeo has air springs, active dampers and an electronic limited-slip differential; the others have conventional steel springs, passive dampers and a mechanical limited-slip differential, which can all be upgraded to Trofeo spec. The upgrade to air suspension costs £1,400.

The options list is quite a scary place, actually, with 21-inch wheels at £1,585, carbon-fibre twill trim at £2,030, a driver assistant pack of adaptive cruise, active lane management, blind-spot monitoring and LED matrix headlights at £2,535 and a Sonus Faber premium 21-speaker sound system at £2,200.

That’s just for starters. The £67,180 Modena tested here ended up at £84,775 when all the extras were included. The Grecale is built at the Alfa Romeo factory in Cassino, Italy, alongside Alfa’s Stelvio SUV, with which it shares its platform (also used in the Alfa Giulia saloon and Jeep Grand Cherokee SUV).

Family SUVs such as the Grecale tend to have generic styling, because that’s what the market likes and no one dares to go against the grain. While the vibe is very much that of the Porsche Macan, the Grecale’s front is lifted by a large, toothy grille with a prominent trident badge. A trademark trio of vents in the wings pull the eye along the body curves and the pronounced haunches over the rear wheels look purposeful.

The front seats are generous, with good lumbar support for your lower back, but quite pinchy side cushions that squash your kidneys after a long time at the wheel. Electronic seat adjustment allows a good driving position, but the seat feels too high and taller drivers might find themselves wishing its base were a couple of inches lower.

The digital facia consists of two screens: the instrument binnacle, which is clear and concise, and a centre touchscreen, which is relatively simple to navigate, with the gear selection buttons underneath. Buttons operate electronic latches to open and shut the doors, which would have been a brave move in the old days of Maserati, and there’s the panoply of modern electronic connectiveness, including a WiFi hotspot, an Alexa virtual assistant and a telephone app that will continue to give you last-mile directions from the satnav after you’ve parked up.

There’s also the traditional Maserati clock at the top centre of the dashboard, now in a switchable-face digital style; such a pity it looks and feels pretty cheap. On the other hand, the trim and fabric choices seem well matched, pleasant to touch and more luxurious than the upmarket herd.

The rear seats are comfortable and plush, with just enough leg room for one 6ft adult sitting behind another. Head room is reasonably generous, too, and three adults fit in the back easily.

The four-cylinder engine sounds flat and unresponsive initially. You need to boot the accelerator pedal, but then it spins up into the strong mid-range, with the electric turbo giving an alacrity to its responses. It sounds good at high revs, but the urge tails off rapidly and there’s not much point in searching for the red line.
 

MarkMas

Chief pedant
Messages
8,899
The ZF eight-speed is a lovely gearbox, slurring changes when needed, kicking down fast when full power is required and responding quickly to the steering-wheel paddles. The Sport setting leaves it in a higher gear than you’d normally choose, but it’s ready for the call.

Will you notice the extra 30bhp of the Modena version? Probably not, but most folk will take it because more is more and the higher power doesn’t punish you too much at the pumps.

The Trofeo is the diva of the range –expensive, the V6 lovely to listen to, technically accomplished … and quite nice to hand back before you face the bills. And while it’s something of a dragster, when it comes to a corner, particularly a bumpy one, it reveals every single one of its extra 187kg over the weight of the Modena.

Like all of these high-riding SUVs, the Grecale has to satisfy the need to ride gently while giving the impression of cornering like a sports car, and the result of this moderation is seldom completely satisfactory.

With all-round independent suspension, Maserati has achieved a good compromise for the air-suspended cars, but a brilliant compromise for the standard steel suspension, which rides well, steers with precision and corners with lean but not sloppiness.

The standard chassis feels well balanced and surprisingly comfortable compared with Porsche’s Macan. This new Maserati, entering one of the most heavily competitive classes of car, feels like one of those left-field choices that turns out to be a surprisingly sound one.

You’ll have your own views on whether Maserati should be providing well-heeled families with SUVs such as this, but then you’d probably have to have the same opinion on Porsche and its equivalent as well.

As it stands, the Grecale is good-looking, with a fine combination (for the class) of ride and handling, while the overall dynamics are impressive. But this is an expensive car – prohibitively so if you dig deep into the options list – and you can have a desirable Porsche Macan with a V6 engine for less whether you buy it outright or take a PCP finance deal.

What’s more, as with any car, Maserati’s claims of great residual values (RV) are hot air until you sell your Grecale or realise the final value settlement after a three-year lease. It’s still a risk, but unlike in the past, the Grecale is slightly less of an affair of the heart and more one of the head.

The facts

Body style: Five-door family SUV
On sale: Summer 2023 (Folgore battery-electric version follows later this year)
How much? range £61,570 to £99,700 (£67,180 as tested)
How fast? 149mph, 0-62mph in 5.3sec
How economical? 30.7mpg to 32.5mpg (WLTP combined), 28.5mpg on test
Engine and gearbox: 1,995cc, four-cylinder turbo petrol with 48-volt mild hybrid system, eight-speed automatic gearbox, four-wheel drivepower/torque 325bhp @ 5,750rpm/332lb ft @ 2,000-5,000rpm
CO2 emissions: 199-210g/km WLTP
VED: £1,565 first year, £570 next five years, then £180
Warranty: 3 years/unlimited mileage

The rivals

Range Rover Velar S P250
from £53,735
Appears much larger than the Grecale, although it’s actually only 4,797mm long. Prices get pretty eye-watering as you go up the range and deeper into the options list, but this sleek and refined 4x4 is best enjoyed in this modest 2.0-litre, 248bhp turbo petrol form. It has a top speed of 135mph, with 0-62mph in 7.1sec, 30.1mpg and 214g/km of CO2.

Porsche Macan S
from £59,800
This rival from Stuttgart costs from £53,400, but the £60,000 S model is a fairer comparison. It punches out 375bhp which delivers a 161mph top speed, with 0-62mph in 4.8sec and a best economy of 25.4mpg, with 251g/km CO2 emissions. The interior exudes typical Porsche craftsmanship and solidity. Great handling, although the ride can be firm.