Brexit Deal

MrMickS

Member
Messages
3,951
Yes, Geoff, the same solution, Qe or money printing apparantly works for the Eu and the rest of the world so we will print £ to get us thru Brexit.
No?

QE is not without cost. Its an inflationary pressure and has an impact on exchange rates, currency confidence, etc. I've no doubt that QE will be used by the BoE post Brexit as one of the ways to keep the economy moving. However if you want to look at what happens if you try to just print your way out of debt look at the issues it caused in Germany between the wars. Its a tool, it has limited use, and needs to be done cautiously as you don't want people to think that you are just going to print money willy-nilly.

So can it be used to fix all post Brexit issues? No.
Will it be used to help ease them? Yes.

Here's the issue with debating people for whom Brexit has adopted a near religious status though, reason goes out of the window. I'm sick and tired of being told that we just need to believe in it and it'll be ok. The world doesn't work like that.

Unfortunately the only alternative to being right royally done over by the US for a start, and everyone else afterwards, is to go with the deal negotiated with the EU. Its not perfect, but it is only a stepping stone, and would give us the ability to negotiate from a position of relative stability.

A no-deal will be messy. All talk of WTO, and other schemes, are complete an utter nonsense once you actually look into the detail. Neither Johnson, or Farage as you appear to think he's something other than a paid for charlatan looking after his own interests, provide any detail on post Brexit deals. Its just waffle and doesn't sit with the facts. Still, I guess I'll be told that "I should believe", or "it won't be as bad as the war", or "we did ok before the EU".

In the same way they confuse Patriotism with racism?

Patriotism is an outdated concept and should be consigned to the dustbin of history along with organised religion. Giving loyalty to something because of an accident of birth is a nonsense in the 21st century. It's a tool used by the elite to manipulate.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
Yes, Geoff, the same solution, Qe or money printing apparantly works for the Eu and the rest of the world so we will print £ to get us thru Brexit.
No?

If that is the case, could it not be argued that apart from us printing as much money as we like, technically, we are in the same dire financial straights as the rest of Europe, except that we are printing more money than them to 'tell' ourselves we are prosperous, when in fact we are not?
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
QE is not without cost. Its an inflationary pressure and has an impact on exchange rates, currency confidence, etc. I've no doubt that QE will be used by the BoE post Brexit as one of the ways to keep the economy moving. However if you want to look at what happens if you try to just print your way out of debt look at the issues it caused in Germany between the wars. Its a tool, it has limited use, and needs to be done cautiously as you don't want people to think that you are just going to print money willy-nilly.

So can it be used to fix all post Brexit issues? No.
Will it be used to help ease them? Yes.

Here's the issue with debating people for whom Brexit has adopted a near religious status though, reason goes out of the window. I'm sick and tired of being told that we just need to believe in it and it'll be ok. The world doesn't work like that.

Unfortunately the only alternative to being right royally done over by the US for a start, and everyone else afterwards, is to go with the deal negotiated with the EU. Its not perfect, but it is only a stepping stone, and would give us the ability to negotiate from a position of relative stability.

A no-deal will be messy. All talk of WTO, and other schemes, are complete an utter nonsense once you actually look into the detail. Neither Johnson, or Farage as you appear to think he's something other than a paid for charlatan looking after his own interests, provide any detail on post Brexit deals. Its just waffle and doesn't sit with the facts. Still, I guess I'll be told that "I should believe", or "it won't be as bad as the war", or "we did ok before the EU".



Patriotism is an outdated concept and should be consigned to the dustbin of history along with organised religion. Giving loyalty to something because of an accident of birth is a nonsense in the 21st century. It's a tool used by the elite to manipulate.
Excellent answer re Qe negatives but Hang on the ECB is constantly money printing!!! In fact Draghi reckons it’s the solution this week ....didn’t he?

In fact despite its failure it wants do even more.....the European Ponzi requires more even tho there’s no suggestion the other trillions did any good.

LTRO etc now lower(negative interest rates).

You’re not a central banker but you said it has “limited use” . Draghi and the Eu think it has unlimited use. They’re out of credibility. Look at the ex IMF guys comments. It’s F7cked!

Sure a no deal will be messy, but the Ponzi Eu cannot afford it and neither can the world.

Patriotism is not an outdated concept if you're Knowledgeable enough to know that this whole thing is fecked on a degree of feckedness that means a break away from the Eu is the lesser of the two evils.....rather than staying in it.
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
An olive branch to remoaners....on behalf of SMDRP members.
In an attempt at unifying the country can I suggest we bury our differences.
SMDRP on behalf of the country, Johnson, Farage et al would like to invite everyone ( referendum and Eu losers alike...remoaners basically) etc around to our place to enjoy a fun evening,
Cue the music
Let’s get over things and move on.....without the Eu.
The references to looking through your tears, gold and sad face are purely coincidental.....get over it and come around to my place. We can all live it up and leave together......
Or stand alone in the corner and cry
Join us and laugh.
 
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GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
An olive branch to remoaners....on behalf of SMDRP members.
In an attempt at unifying the country can I suggest we bury our differences.
SMDRP on behalf of the country, Johnson, Farage et al would like to invite everyone ( referendum and Eu losers) etc around to our place to enjoy a fun evening,
Cue the music
Let’s get over things and move on.....without the Eu.
The references to looking through your tears, gold and sad face are purely coicidental.....get over it and come around to my place. We can all live it up and leave together......
Or stand alone in the corner and cry
,

Great song. Can you name the film it was in?????
 

Wanderer

Member
Messages
5,791
^ definitely this
This is the Peace of Westphalia coming up again!

Rampant Capitalism and consumerism has accelerated this, people can fly anywhere for buttons, people have decent smartphones even in **** countries. We strip their natural assets from them in return for a few trinkets, start a war if they get bolshy, that would be it in the good old Empire days and even until 60/70's but now even the fuzzy-wuzzies have smartphones and internet, they can see what they've been left with and how thing are better in the place their stuff has gone to. So off they go, for a better life and yes for economic reasons and who can blame them?

Who says the bit of dirt you were lucky of unlucky enough to be born on is somehow your birth right and you are somehow stuck with it?

Answer? The people born on the best bits of dirt.

So now it's easy for Mr Migrant to see what it's like on the other side of the wall and easy to get there. Like it not this is the future. jus solis, jus sanguis no matter. If were the money/nice life is now.
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
If that is the case, could it not be argued that apart from us printing as much money as we like, technically, we are in the same dire financial straights as the rest of Europe, except that we are printing more money than them to 'tell' ourselves we are prosperous, when in fact we are not?
No we are not in the same dire straits....but we can print our way through it if necessary.
Europe has the current crisis and 19 countries to support.......
Who would you back?
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
This is the Peace of Westphalia coming up again!

Rampant Capitalism and consumerism has accelerated this, people can fly anywhere for buttons, people have decent smartphones even in **** countries. We strip their natural assets from them in return for a few trinkets, start a war if they get bolshy, that would be it in the good old Empire days and even until 60/70's but now even the fuzzy-wuzzies have smartphones and internet, they can see what they've been left with and how thing are better in the place their stuff has gone to. So off they go, for a better life and yes for economic reasons and who can blame them?

Who says the bit of dirt you were lucky of unlucky enough to be born on is somehow your birth right and you are somehow stuck with it?

Answer? The people born on the best bits of dirt.

So now it's easy for Mr Migrant to see what it's like on the other side of the wall and easy to get there. Like it not this is the future. jus solis, jus sanguis no matter. If were the money/nice life is now.
Mods?
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
^ definitely this
Bs, definitely this
Patriotism is not an outdated concept if you're Knowledgeable enough to know that this whole thing is fecked on a degree of feckedness that means a break away from the Eu is the lesser of the two evils.....rather than staying in it.
 

Wanderer

Member
Messages
5,791
Bs, definitely this
Patriotism is not an outdated concept if you're Knowledgeable enough to know that this whole thing is fecked on a degree of feckedness that means a break away from the Eu is the lesser of the two evils.....rather than staying in it.
April 4th, 1984. Last night to the flicks. All war films. One very good one of a ship full of refugees being bombed somewhere in the Mediterranean. Audience much amused by shots of a great huge fat man trying to swim away with a helicopter after him, first you saw him wallowing along in the water like a porpoise, then you saw him through the helicopters gunsights, then he was full of holes and the sea round him turned pink and he sank as suddenly as though the holes had let in the water, audience shouting with laughter when he sank. then you saw a lifeboat full of children with a helicopter hovering over it. There was a middle-aged woman might have been a Jewess sitting up in the bow with a little boy about three years old in her arms. little boy screaming with fright and hiding his head between her breasts as if he was trying to burrow right into her and the woman putting her arms round him and comforting him although she was blue with fright herself. all the time covering him up as much as possible as if she thought her arms could keep the bullets off him. then the helicopter planted a 20 kilo bomb in among them terrific flash and the boat went all to matchwood. then there was a wonderful shot of a child's arm going up up up right up into the air a helicopter with a camera in its nose must have followed it up and there was a lot of applause from the party seats but a woman down in the prole part of the house suddenly started kicking up a fuss and shouting they didnt oughter of showed it not in front of kids they didnt it aint right not in front of kids it aint until the police turned her turned her out i dont suppose anything happened to her nobody cares..

Patriotism, eh?

57786
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
“Bank of England governor Mark Carney dismisses Boris Johnson no-deal Brexit trade claims”

Why would he do this publically unless he was trying to undermine Brexit and our negotiating position?
This does not serve the Uk. Isn’t he supposed to be on our side?

It’s quite clear now that the powers that be don’t want this to happen.

The Tories won’t deliver this.....new PM or not.

The Canadian led BOE (central banker so knows feck all) won’t support this.....clearly.

Parliaments we’ll invoke A50 but we don’t t believe in it....shows where they lie.

Behold Revolutionary politics.
One mans freedom fighter, is another’s mans terrorist.
 

JonW

Member
Messages
3,259
“Bank of England governor Mark Carney dismisses Boris Johnson no-deal Brexit trade claims”

Why would he do this publically unless he was trying to undermine Brexit and our negotiating position?

Because he, unlike Boris, is willing to speak the truth and describe how the general agreement on trade and tariffs (GATT) actually works.

What Carney is saying is based in fact, and is agreed by several other trade experts, including the head of the World Trade Organisation...

What Boris has said is what he wants to be true, and what he wants to be able to negotiate...

Hope this answer the question you posed!?
 
Messages
6,001
Mark Carney has also been described as 'an unreliable boyfriend' by a Treasury Committee member and MP

Constantly (through his tenure) of dropping hints about an interest rate hike or maybe not a couple of months later
He does not know what is going to happen like the rest of us yet he is still an expert
 

JonW

Member
Messages
3,259
Mark Carney has also been described as 'an unreliable boyfriend' by a Treasury Committee member and MP

Constantly (through his tenure) of dropping hints about an interest rate hike or maybe not a couple of months later
He does not know what is going to happen like the rest of us yet he is still an expert

Agreed. I’m not really a fan of Carney and think he is too fond of publicity and seeing himself in the press.

However, it is, as I understand it, fairly clear and generally accepted that what Boris has said is ******** and factually inaccurate.

Boris said (paraphrasing) that if we agree to leave with no deal there would be no tariffs.

Carney has said this is inaccurate and not how GATT works.

If Boris had said no one knows how it will work but that he would try to negotiate an arrangement whereby there are no tariffs if we leave with out an agreed withdrawal agreement - then that would be true and fine...