3200GTA camshaft problem?

[boomerang]

Recently i bought a UK 3200GTA with only 56k miles.
The engine runs, oil pressure is ok, only valvetrain noise is audible at the left hand cilinder head.

This is how almost every lobe/valve clearance cap looks like.



What could be the cause of this, has anyone ever seen something like this?

 

[jluis]

My guess is someone used cheap Chinese shims to adjust clearance and they started disintegrating.
Your oil filter and sump are probably filed with metallic debris

 

[Rex B]

Tappet clearances should be checked at every major service and perhaps this has not been done, also looks like might not be getting enough oil to that head or has not had regular oil changes.

Rex B

Manual 3200

 

[alfatwo]

Oooh you bugger, I've seen this a few times on Alfa engines...the oil ways to the head get blocked for whatever reason..

A good second hand head complete with cams is required. While your at it check there's no other damage as that's bordering terminal!


Dave

 

[CatmanV2]

I have to say, I thought it looked a bit dry in there.

C

 

[alfatwo]

I have to say, I thought it looked a bit dry in there.

C

Yea, just think where all those metal particles have gone...I'd also check the crank bearings for damage too


Dave

 

[jluis]

I have to say, I thought it looked a bit dry in there.

C

There is oil around the tappets.
OP might have cleaned up the oil on the shim for better visibility on the picture.
To me it looks like it was wiped clean

 

[CatmanV2]

There is oil around the tappets.
OP might have cleaned up the oil on the shim for better visibility on the picture.
To me it looks like it was wiped clean

Which is why I didn't mention it earlier, really. I've not pulled enough heads to make the judgement....

C

 

[jluis]

Yea, just think where all those metal particles have gone...I'd also check the crank bearings for damage too


Dave

Oil filter and sump pickup screen are supposed to keep those away from the oil pumping circuit, no?
Some cars also have the oil drain plug with a magnet to collect these debris, although I dont remember the plug on my 3200 to stick to metal tools when I changed the oil last time

 

[davy83]

There is a magnet in the sump to pick up debris. you have to take the sump cover off to get at it.

 

[boomerang]

Exactly my thoughts and worries indeed.
And in the picture, parts where degreased, that is correct.

Meanwhile; Took the camshafts out, and found bearing yournals without traces of wear, thats one thing positive...
So wear is visable at the Lobes, NOT at yournals/bearings/bearing caps in the cilinder heads.
Did find a supplier for a set of very nice used cams for a nice price, so that will not be the biggest problem.

Did have some doubts however; Just fit the new cams, set timing, new oil and filter and then wait and see, or better examin other things first.
I think i will take the sump cover down first, to check some rod bearings, before i really start investing in this engine.
Must say, even when warm, no strange noises could be heard at the bottom end of the engine.
I tried to provoke rod bearing noises, but all seemed well.
That is why doubts came up....

Still, i presume best scenario (all is well down at the crank) will not be the case, hopefully second best is; new bearings and maybe some polishing of the yournals needed.
Worst case....everything damaged beyond repair.
Thats where it ends then.
Will keep you guys posted and bring in some pics.

 

[jluis]

I would pull out the sump and inspect the bottom first.
You either have substandard shims, a lubrication problem on that head or at one point in time that head had contaminants that caused that.

I read about guys that take out their valve covers, have them sandblasted to look new and shining and then some sand finds its way into the head resulting in the same as what you are now seeing

 

[Rex B]

If you look at the 3200 engine manual I think the setting up of the oil pump clearances is critical to the oil supply to one of the heads, can't remember which one but could be a contributing factor

Rex B

 

[boomerang]

I would pull out the sump and inspect the bottom first.

Did that.
But sadly...there is nothing to inspect at the bottom of the sump.
If you take the bottom plate off, you will not be able to reach any of the bearing caps, so inspection will not be possible.
The only way to get at the bearings is to take out the engine and split its bottom housing at the crank.
Dum action all in all, should have checked some pics first, i would have known then.

Will fetch the new cams first and mount them.
If everything runs fine, i will heat the engine at its max operating (oil ) temperature and watch the readings of an external oil pressure meter.
If pressure is ok under very hot conditions, i will leave it that way, if not, the engine has to come out to see if there is damage at the bearings.

In that case, we have a nice winter project on our hand.

 

[jluis]

But you should be able to see in the mesh screen and interior of sump for metallic debris.
Can you use one of those mini cameras mounted on a flex pipe to reach into the crankshaft bearings from bellow?

 

[boomerang]

No, it was my intention to take off one or two conrod bearing caps, but that wont work.
Did take off the oil lines this afternoon (to the oil cooler) and carefully investigated the oil taken from there.
No metal particles, nothing to worry about.
So i am going to move forward now and exchange the cams and clearance shims first.
After that, we will see what happens.