Are you worried yet.

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CatmanV2

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Fair enough, just saying we can not blame the government for providing this recess in the regulations, it’s up to us all as to how we manage it, whether the decision is made by the elderly or the younger generation. It’s the general public’s decision to be made wisely, if that’s possible.

It would help if the government would actually treat the public like (mostly) adults and provide data as well as logical regulations so that a sensible assessment of risk is broadcast, not the 'Is that what you want? "Cos that's what'll happen" segment of the Harry Enfield show.

Sorry but this is pissing me off. It's not about the regs per se, it's about the BS justification of them.

C
 

rockits

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9,167
Just catching up on this thread and others as been constantly snowed with work so time has not been my friend.

For me I have a real trust issue with so many things these days and the vaccine will be another. I have to make my own mind up about so many things as don't trust the UK govt and other entities are looking out for mine and my families best interests. Nor that they are making the best decisions or for the right reasons.

I have found there has been so much extreme quick action often way over the top and out of proportion on occasion. Then a complete opposite when I felt action need to be quick, hard and deep.

When a vaccine is fully tested and safe also has been used on many other more needy people first I would consider it. At the moment not on your nelly are they injecting me with anything in 2020 or likely all of 2021. However I'll keep an open mind as I always do and revise thoughts accordingly.

I don't feel concerned at all for myself or my family now in contracting or getting Covid based on what I know or understand. I will still do all I can to make sure we keep others safe and not compromised. I was initially much more concerned but after lots more knowledge, info and time means I don't see it as the massive issue it has been purported to be. It is no Black Plague.

To be forced to take the vaccine in order to be allowed to fly and things along these lines I have a real real issue with. This should be a choice. I am not one of these conspiracy theorists harking on about taking our civil rights and liberties away. It is just a massive sledgehammer to crack a walnut. I would have no problem taking a test and making sure I was negative tested to fly however.

Our neighbours are in their 80's. The husband is not 100% as strong as he was after a stroke a few years back but is still decent enough health although clearly well at risk and vulnerable. They want to live their life as not sure how many days they have left. I'm not sure I can really argue much with this. We are taking people's lives away and there is little quality there for some. If they want to take risks to their own health, as long as this doesn't put others at risk, they should be allowed to make their own choices. These should not be forced as we may as well become a communist state.

I just feel we have taken some massive decisions for today, tomorrow and many years down the line which for me is at odds with the threat we faced. It is not balanced or aligned IMHO and over the top. The risk and numbers of issues don't warrant the actions taken or the damage it has caused. Both to excess unrelated deaths/treatments and the economic woe it has caused and will continue to cause for many years even decades.
 

Wattie

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Hi, slowly on the mend thanks.
I’m not generally anti vaccine, in fact to date me/ the family are fully vaccinated in line with requirements.
My concerns arise from the fact that
  1. These have been rushed through in months....not the usual years it takes for a full safety analysis.
  2. There’s little data to suggest that they’re gonna provide immunity for any more than a few months, potentially requiring regular boosters, particularly if new strains require new vaccine tweaks. You could therefore be injecting a cocktail into yourself over time - no assessment of the risks has been undertaken. God knows what damage it could be doing.
  3. I now think the risks to the majority are minimal, indeed many eminent and knowledgeable medical staff have suggested such but as it’s against mainstream messaging have been overlooked. Most that die are elderly or with health conditions....a very small %.
  4. Australia, is currently virtually covid free. It’s been suggested that i’ll Need a vaccine to travel. Why would I want to travel to somewhere that’s locked down or in whatever tier the local Govt see fit to introduce.
So, it’s a no thanks from me at this point. In no hurry to be vaccinated, I’ll let others be the lab rats and sit back and watch what transpires.
It’ll take years and years to vaccinate the numbers they’re talking about.....ignoring ongoing boosters.

 

MarkMas

Chief pedant
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I just don't understand the psychology of seeking out and promoting this kind of negativity. Where is the joy in searching the Press (or worse, crappy conspiracy websites) for any kind of article like this one, that offers the most negative spin on everything and the worst case scenarios for the future? I think maybe people feel that it means they are 'in the know' or 'not being fooled' or even 'able to prepare properly', but it seems to me just a way to continually fuel one's own state of anxiety and unhappiness, and to try to generate a similar experience for other people. It's clearly a very common human trait, but I don't understand why it should be so prevalent, since it doesn't seem to be at all useful. I wonder if it is a sort of hangover from a practical pessimism, where storing up a bit of extra corn for the winter or being extra vigilant for snakes was actually useful, but nowadays, broadcasting doom-saying about, say, unknown details of mRNA-based vaccine trials methodologies, or the movements of the Russian North Sea fleet seems utterly pointless, and probably harmful.
 

Wattie

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8,640
I just don't understand the psychology of seeking out and promoting this kind of negativity. Where is the joy in searching the Press (or worse, crappy conspiracy websites) for any kind of article like this one, that offers the most negative spin on everything and the worst case scenarios for the future? I think maybe people feel that it means they are 'in the know' or 'not being fooled' or even 'able to prepare properly', but it seems to me just a way to continually fuel one's own state of anxiety and unhappiness, and to try to generate a similar experience for other people. It's clearly a very common human trait, but I don't understand why it should be so prevalent, since it doesn't seem to be at all useful. I wonder if it is a sort of hangover from a practical pessimism, where storing up a bit of extra corn for the winter or being extra vigilant for snakes was actually useful, but nowadays, broadcasting doom-saying about, say, unknown details of mRNA-based vaccine trials methodologies, or the movements of the Russian North Sea fleet seems utterly pointless, and probably harmful.
Hang on, I was asked directly why I wouldnt take a vaccine, which I explained.
This article covers some of the feelings I have (and indeed many others have too) towards the topic -hence it’s relevance.
I read your explanation and complimented you on it, even though it Conflicts with my thoughts.

You don’t have to read what I post and if you think it’s negative that’s fine. Fact is, there are two sides to this topic whether you wanna believe that or not. Not everybody is convinced that the vaccines are needed or are indeed the solution.....including eminent scientists.

I disagree with the crappy conspiracy website comment too. I think much of the Govt information you’re fed is total ****.

I take offence to the suggestion that i’m unhappy and i’m certainly not anxious. I have an amazing life and family and I’m very keen to protect that and our lifestyle in this ridiculous situation that everyone finds themselves in.
 
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GeoffCapes

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14,000
Today my little part of Kent has 182 cases per 100,000. However this afternoon we will no doubt be in Tier 3 or even 4 if they decide to make that one up because of two areas (Swale & Thanet) 50-60 miles away having the highest and 4th highest numbers for the country.

Lovely!

An expert on the news this morning said that there was a "wilful non-compliance of the lockdown rules in the county" Which I have to agree with and the roads have never been busier, the shops (which are open) are mobbed, and judging by the people I know at least, are seeing friends and family in large groups as if there was no lockdown at all.

My wife's best friend has decided to take her kids out of school as she is concerned about them catching it as school and passing it on to her mum who has a very poor immune system from Chemo last year, yet she's out and about every day!

Give me strength!!!!!!!!!!
 

GTVGEOFF

Member
Messages
381
Well has it was me that ask the question so I feel I should reply.
I am heading towards seventy and had high grade non Hodgkin's lymphoma
a couple of years back, so consider myself in the vunrable group.
The chemo got on top of the cancer and I now feel ok, after that experience I promised myself to enjoy every day. Then along comes Covid it and scuppers my plans, so I have to wieght up the risks if I catch Covid it will probably see me off. The vaccine gives me a chance to live the time I have left more normally, but I accept with risks.
The reason I asked the question was I certainly don't know it all and I like to be has well informed as I can be, so by asking others opinions I learn.
Reading the zero Hedge article gives me another angle, thanks for posting
Like everything in life we have to make our own minds up, but that only makes it right for me not others.
If I was Wattie in a low level Covid area and I am guessing much younger than me I would probably sit back for a while too. So squeak squeak.
 

Wattie

Member
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8,640
Well has it was me that ask the question so I feel I should reply.
I am heading towards seventy and had high grade non Hodgkin's lymphoma
a couple of years back, so consider myself in the vunrable group.
The chemo got on top of the cancer and I now feel ok, after that experience I promised myself to enjoy every day. Then along comes Covid it and scuppers my plans, so I have to wieght up the risks if I catch Covid it will probably see me off. The vaccine gives me a chance to live the time I have left more normally, but I accept with risks.
The reason I asked the question was I certainly don't know it all and I like to be has well informed as I can be, so by asking others opinions I learn.
Reading the zero Hedge article gives me another angle, thanks for posting
Like everything in life we have to make our own minds up, but that only makes it right for me not others.
If I was Wattie in a low level Covid area and I am guessing much younger than me I would probably sit back for a while too. So squeak squeak.
Good luck with whatever decision you make.
I’m 55 but am now classed as having a pre-existing condition that in theory makes me Covid vulnerable.

Someone on here is rabbiting on about facts so here’s one. Currently less than 3% of those with Covid die......it’s probably a lot less as many more have gone untested and the treatment of the condition has improved over time.

97% survival rates (without a vaccine) are odds that i’ll happily take.
 

Rwc13

Member
Messages
1,668
I just don't understand the psychology of seeking out and promoting this kind of negativity. Where is the joy in searching the Press (or worse, crappy conspiracy websites) for any kind of article like this one, that offers the most negative spin on everything and the worst case scenarios for the future? I think maybe people feel that it means they are 'in the know' or 'not being fooled' or even 'able to prepare properly', but it seems to me just a way to continually fuel one's own state of anxiety and unhappiness, and to try to generate a similar experience for other people. It's clearly a very common human trait, but I don't understand why it should be so prevalent, since it doesn't seem to be at all useful. I wonder if it is a sort of hangover from a practical pessimism, where storing up a bit of extra corn for the winter or being extra vigilant for snakes was actually useful, but nowadays, broadcasting doom-saying about, say, unknown details of mRNA-based vaccine trials methodologies, or the movements of the Russian North Sea fleet seems utterly pointless, and probably harmful.
No negative comment about the Russian vaccine! I wonder why
 

CatmanV2

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Messages
48,539
True , but should they be feeding them at all out of public money , they're paid a salary.

Ahh, interesting question. (Their salary is also paid out of public money, BTW)
I don't know. I've often bought my teams lunch or takeaway if we're working late. Of course, that's private money. Given the sums involved (compared to the £20m to pay for a week of free school meals) its a lot for any of us to buy a takeaway, but probably not something that I'm going to get overly vexed about.

Of course, if you want to get upset because it a specific, underserving group that are getting a free lunch (or two, I think it might have been), again we need to know who got it.

A quick look on their menu shows their most expensive main comes in at £12 add a can at £2.50 we can call it £15 a head. Not too bad for a takeaway in central London, although rather more than an M+S sarnie or even a Pret platter. So I guess that's about 3300 meals. (Although they are apparently closing permanently now, due to lockdown)

Unless you think there's some conspiracy to order thousands of pounds worth of food, and throw it at the homeless, or something.

Further clarification (helpfully missing from the first article)
'that the orders fed a mix of civil servants, NHS staff, military personnel, and private sector workers who were working up to 18 hours a day, sometimes seven days a week during the first wave of the coronavirus crisis:'
'a spokesperson later added that the spending was “necessary to ensure staff working shifts were able to access hot food when other catering options were unavailable during lockdown, until alternative arrangements could be made.”'

However, if you fancy:
'One of Bong Bong’s investors is married to a Conservative councillor...' Which may at least have some bearing on the selection. Or indeed may have resulted in a discount (**** I'd want one if I was spending that kind of cash!)

So, in answer to your question: On balance, I don't think it's unreasonable to use public money to feed public servants in extremis. YMMV, or course,

C
 

rockits

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9,167
I like to think I'm a reasonably level headed person seeking all the data and information I can find however not rely on. Then I'll take a broad stab at the best informed decisions I can. I don't see the risks as high so won't panic or do anything extreme.

A vaccine for me or my family that has not been fully tested or proven over time is however a much higher risk IMHO. Nothing clever or fancy just simple cold hard facts. Everybody is different and will draw different conclusions then make different decisions based on their circumstances or thoughts. To not allow me the privilege to do this or respect this is not right IMHO.

I've never needed a vaccine to fly in my life ever to date and we have had worse health issues far worse than Covid 19. If someone wants to they can if they don't want to you can't force them. You might as well lock me up and throw away the key.
 

safrane

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Funny that there is a barr on all Civil Servant Depts buying food for staff, including tea and coffee at training event's/ meetings etc... unless of course your Minister buys it and then claims back.
 

philw696

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25,113
Asking on behalf of a friend; does that mean he isn’t allowed to drive the 5 hours to Kent to see the in-laws at Christmas?
Ms French's mother is in New Caledonia a nice little bit of Paradise but we won't be leaving the Pay de la Loire.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
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14,000
Asking on behalf of a friend; does that mean he isn’t allowed to drive the 5 hours to Kent to see the in-laws at Christmas?

The missus has just reminded me that the tiers are all going to be scrapped on the 23rd so luckily you can see the in-laws in Kent after all!

Lucky you! :lol2::lol2::lol2:
 
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