Should I be worried?

Nikko · Jul 20, 2019

Hi to all
After 20 years driving various Alfas and with the Giulia QV out of reach it's time to purchase a dream car of mine the QP or even an early model Granturismo.
Having had one Alfa engine go on me should I be worried about buying a vehicle that's not had the Variator issue sorted?
As one seller stated, if they all needed this doing nobody would be buying them!

Felonious Crud · Jul 20, 2019

Hi Nikko, welcome. This variators thing really has got people twitching. My old GTS was within the range that might one day start to make a noise and never did. At 53k miles (I think) when I sold it there wasn’t a glimmer of rattle. It’s also not a death sentence, it just sounds like a bag of spanners for the first couple of seconds after starting.

You certainly shouldn’t be worried, but you should be scouring the ads and planning to get an indie inspection when you find one.

As an aside, I think you get more bang for your buck with a QP than a GT.

Ryandoc · Jul 20, 2019

I’ve never actually figured out if my 2009 GTS is at risk, I saved a screen shot of a thread once that had the VIN number range to look out for and I’ve never checked.

I’m on 55k miles and no hint of anything, I’m aware it’ll cost a few quid to sort if it happens, but then a clutch is pants down time. As felonious says it’s not terminal so if it happens just need to fund it and cry a little into my breakfast, but I’ll live

Ewan · Jul 20, 2019

Lots of the cars which technically may be effected are still fine, at 50k miles and more. In the same way that most Porsche 996/997 and Boxsters are not effected by their well publicised RMS/IMS issues. Even if it does happen, it’s just a brief rattle sound on start up and is not a serious problem - you could run the car for years like this, and many people do.

I really don’t think it’s a bid deal and it wouldn't stop me buying any QP or GT. That said, it’s easy enough to buy one from the non-effected periods, or that has had the adaptation. So if you think it is a risk you don’t fancy taking, simply buy one of those.

cheshiremaserati · Jul 20, 2019

Nikko said:
Hi to all
After 20 years driving various Alfas and with the Giulia QV out of reach it's time to purchase a dream car of mine the QP or even an early model Granturismo.
Having had one Alfa engine go on me should I be worried about buying a vehicle that's not had the Variator issue sorted?
As one seller stated, if they all needed this doing nobody would be buying them!

I would recommend you speak to a good indy and seek a professional opinion on variator issue, the weak points and corrosion areas and then have a PPI on any prospective purchase. I dont know Maserati brand as well as Porsche but with the latter there are numerous posts about expensive rebuilds due to bore scoring rather than IMS failure that a guru (Baz Hart at Hartech) is clear it is about when not if the car succumbs and results in a £12k rebuild on a car worth not much more. No idea about variators though - but an indy who sees these cars will probably give a total picture to help you decide a way forward.

Ewan · Jul 20, 2019

The variator fix on an effected Maser engine is around £2.5k plus VAT. So nothing like as terminal or expensive as the Porsche engine problems. Plus you can ignore it if you choose to, it's just a slight rattle noise for about 2 seconds when you first turn the key. But even so, it's easiest just to buy a car that has either been fixed or will not be effected. The potentially effected cars were built between approx. 2007-9, and the engine numbers can be found on a sperate thread. It's simple enough to check the engine number of the car you are intertest in against the numbers on the list. Takes about 1 minute and costs nothing.

Ryandoc · Jul 20, 2019

Engine number less than 148697 is the screenshot I have saved from a thread on here

ChrisQP09 · Jul 20, 2019

I recently enquired into a 09' car with an engine number below 148 and it had 65k miles with no indication of rattling etc.

cheshiremaserati · Jul 20, 2019

Ewan said:
The variator fix on an effected Maser engine is around £2.5k plus VAT. So nothing like as terminal or expensive as the Porsche engine problems. Plus you can ignore it if you choose to, it's just a slight rattle noise for about 2 seconds when you first turn the key. But even so, it's easiest just to buy a car that has either been fixed or will not be effected. The potentially effected cars were built between approx. 2007-9, and the engine numbers can be found on a sperate thread. It's simple enough to check the engine number of the car you are intertest in against the numbers on the list. Takes about 1 minute and costs nothing.

Thats intetesting that it is not as bad as the Porsche bore-scoring example. But I seem to recall JKulin on here with his variator issue and the hassle he had from the dealer not wanting to sort it out. In his thread he had mentioned £4000 but I cant recall the details. And in that discussion mention of a half-attempt solution at £1500+VAT. Either way, IF I was in the market for one of these affected cars, I'd only buy with evidence of a total fix or buy a later series car that does not suffer the issue. I dont accept a car has no ptoblem at 60k miles whatever - like Porsche, the evidence points strongly to a flaw in the design that Maserati addressed much as Porsche scrapped the chocolate NA engine in the 996/997.2/9x6 Boxster etc and replaced with a new DFI engine.

Its down to ones attitude to risk I guess.

Ewan · Jul 20, 2019

That’s right. There is a cheap “fix” at about £1.5k, but a proper fix is towards double that. Naturally prices vary slightly from place to place, e.g. main dealer to independent. But if you think £3k all in, you’re about there.

Goodfella · Jul 20, 2019

Considering I’ve just spent £3.5k on a small service, a few bits and an oil leak fix it’s not that big a deal in the Maserati world is it?

(Although I appreciate I want full dealer history and an A1 condition car)

Just to re-iterate the engine number from the main man himself..

Ryandoc · Jul 20, 2019

So I’ve decided to finally check, silly question time I assume engine number is the last digits on the VIN in the windscreen ?

ChrisQP09 · Jul 20, 2019

Ryandoc said:
So I’ve decided to finally check, silly question time I assume engine number is the last digits on the VIN in the windscreen ?

It will be in the v5c form.

bigbob · Jul 20, 2019

Ryandoc said:
So I’ve decided to finally check, silly question time I assume engine number is the last digits on the VIN in the windscreen ?

No but if you have any Maserati dealer invoices they have a box that shows engine number.

Nikko · Jul 21, 2019

bigbob said:
No but if you have any Maserati dealer invoices they have a box that shows engine number.

Thanks for all your replies.
It’s good to know how to obtain the engine number and that you can live with the Variator problem.

ChrisQP09 · Jul 21, 2019

Nikko said:
Thanks for all your replies.
It’s good to know how to obtain the engine number and that you can live with the Variator problem.

You can certainly live with it. In public places however it can be embarrassing if your Maser is rattling like a tin can for 10 seconds.

Lavazza · Jul 21, 2019

Is the engine number a definitive 'it will happen eventually' due to a particular design?

Or, some engines 'may' be affected within that range, I.e. some engines will not have that design flaw, and may never have the problem?

Felonious Crud · Jul 21, 2019

Conventional wisdom suggests that a car used 'regularly' (whatever that means, but let's assume every couple of weeks) may never suffer. Those that are left standing for longer period are more at risk.

Of course, someone armed with some actual facts may be along soon to say otherwise.

gb-gta · Jul 21, 2019

I have had several Alfa’s too, still got a couple actually that I need to sell really since I got my QP GTS, a 147GTA and a guilietta QV.

The variator thing is similar to the ‘when was the cam belt last done’ question on busso engines. There are many other things to check on these too, it just seems to be the highest profile question.

With the QP or GT, of course it’s best to get a later car, or one with it done, but you could find one with the variator done, but needing tyres and brakes all round soon. That could cost more, or subframe issues. There was a bill in the history of mine for example for an air con compressor. That was £1.5k. Things can quickly add up!

Just find a car with the spec/colour scheme you want, check everything carefully, then get it bought and be a happy man! (Obviously having gone in aware of the running costs).

Good luck!

Nikko · Jul 21, 2019

First job with all my old Alfa’s was always the cambelt . The old GTAs are now fetching good money, and I did consider going back to one but it seemed like a step backwards .

Is there any problems with a higher mileage engine as long as it’s been looked after?

Should I be worried?

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