Help needed: Misfires and other CEL's - Detailed account of the situation

ecarca · Oct 28, 2014

Yes I did, same symptoms...

2b1ask1 · Oct 28, 2014

That's great work, those filters show just how much junk is in the fuel we buy, not an insubstantial amount there.

I'm looking to treat mine to a clean up and the Terraclean system seems to get the results: http://www.terraclean.co.uk/

I did contact them when they first launched in the UK to see about a possible forum/group buy but never heard back from them, if I can find the time it may be worth looking into again...

Good luck with tracking down the gremlins...

hodroyd · Oct 28, 2014

Is the cable from the MAF to the ECU in good condition along it's entire length, no signs of trapping, rubbing or burning anywhere..??

ecarca · Oct 30, 2014

hodroyd said:
Is the cable from the MAF to the ECU in good condition along it's entire length, no signs of trapping, rubbing or burning anywhere..??

I think it is, I will double check but this thing starts to get very tricky.
If it was the injectors, the problem would probably be the same with MAF plugged or not. If it not fueling, it should be air but then if it is not air, I am lost...

hodroyd · Oct 30, 2014

Have you tried with the MAF plugged in but the airbox and pipe disconnected after the MAF, just a thought..?? Does it sound like it for example has a choke on the engine..??

ecarca · Jan 15, 2015

The idle is hunting a bit as well and I had problems with hot start recently. On 4 of 5 occurrences, the car would not restart as usual. I had to crank the engine for about 10 seconds and give it full throttle for it to half start then start. It also choke after restart once or twice.

Here is a video of the idle hunting symptom. It sometimes stops after giving it a little throttle, sometimes not. Other than that, it seems to run fine. I am not sure wether it is linked to my initial problem or not.

[video=youtube;MSdHeOiV7iI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSdHeOiV7iI[/video]

Could it be variator related or solenoid control valve related? Not sure about that but I read some stuff about this recently and it is at the back of my mind. Other than that I found new injectors for a good price and might give it a try as well but I don't think it is a fueling issue...

CatmanV2 · Jan 15, 2015

I've had the choking on start when it's a 'warm' start, but my idle is steady as a rock
C

ecarca · Jan 21, 2015

I just ordered:
- a crank position sensor,
- 4 ignition coils (2 front and 2 back) for bank 1, and
- 4 injectors also for bank 1.

We will see what happens next. Worst case scenario, I'll have spare or parts for sale

ecarca · Jan 29, 2015

I ruled out the injectors. Since the misfires are coming mainly from bank 2, I replaced all bank 2 injectors. Exact same symptoms.
I am waiting for the coils and CPS.

BL330 · Jan 29, 2015

Hi Emmanuel,
My MAF sensor needed replacing as it through up a Check Engine Light. I bought the chamber & sensor from Eurospares.
When my local guy changed it, he pointed out the disgusting state of the throttle body. The dry sump breather tube feeds in after the MAF and before the throttle body, sucking in oily fumes as its supposed to do.
He cleaned this by cloth not using the regular sprays as he said they can ruin the bearings on the butterfly and ruin sensors within the plenum chamber.
This might be worth a check for you.
The car performed brilliantly after the MAF change, throttle body clean and importantly he cleared the CEL.
Hope this helps, Bruce

ecarca · Jan 29, 2015

Thanks Bruce!
Incidentally, I actually did clean the throttle body for the second time in a year this week-end. Because I happened to install a BMC air filter and replace my serpentine belt

It is one of the first thing I tried. This said, my TB was a bit dirty this time and the car worked better after. Cheers!

PS: I am coming to OZ soon but not stopping in Canberra. I wanted to stop there overnight while driving from Melbourne to Sidney but I have only a week and going all the way up to Brisbane, maybe next time

conaero · Jan 29, 2015

I have a spare working Throttle body, MAF, injectors and coil packs, if you want to bring it over and try swapping some of the bits out your more than welcome to.

CraigWaterman11 · Jan 29, 2015

Conaero you're a gentleman. It's good to see people actually trying to help someone on the forums with parts they have. It might not be a bad idea to swap that throttle body out just to see what happens. For the life of me, after reading everything he's done I'm drawing blanks on it. I mean possibly the ECU, it would be nice if he could swap that out as well just to see. But it's very strange. He has brand new plugs, coils, he's swapped around the coil packs. He swears he's checked everywhere for leaks.......

I know he hasn't tried a compression test on the cylinders but that would be unlikely in his situation. I'm thinking if he tried swapping the throttle body and seeing if that helps it wouldn't be the first time like similar issues in other models has come up from it. Usually a cleaning fixes it but, he's also tried that twice.

Watching with interest.........

voicey · Jan 29, 2015

I take it you're not in the UK. Does your country have some kind of mandatory emissions testing? If so can you get someone to measure the hydrocarbons in your exhaust? If you actually have a misfire on one bank then the exhaust gas on that side will be full of HC. If you don't have HC then you have a sensor issue.

If you do have HC then there's loads of things that could cause it from a fault coil (cheap) to a broken valve spring (not so cheap).

ecarca · Jan 30, 2015

Conaero said:
I have a spare working Throttle body, MAF, injectors and coil packs, if you want to bring it over and try swapping some of the bits out your more than welcome to.

Thank you for the offer Conaero but the round trip from Shanghai for the car, even in a container, is not the best option LOL

ecarca · Jan 30, 2015

CraigWaterman11 said:
He has brand new plugs, coils, he's swapped around the coil packs. He swears he's checked everywhere for leaks.......

I know he hasn't tried a compression test on the cylinders but that would be unlikely in his situation. I'm thinking if he tried swapping the throttle body and seeing if that helps it wouldn't be the first time like similar issues in other models has come up from it. Usually a cleaning fixes it but, he's also tried that twice.

Watching with interest.........

I did not receive the coils yet! So it still could be the coils. Leaks are excluded for sure, I purchased a smoke machine just for that. It reminds me that I still need to try to sell it to my local garage

TB failure? Maybe...

The problem at this stage is simple: misfires, mainly on bank 2 after replugging the MAF. They are really strong after replugging the MAF but I have the feeling the are here as well but less intense without MAF. It only happens under 2000 rpm. Also when the MAF is on, the car dumps a lot of fuel in bank 1 and removes quite a lot from bank 2.

ECU swap is in my mind but I will never find a ECU here... Does the ECU from the 4200 works on a GS? I know they have quite a few 4200 and I know a place where they have one for sale for ever. Maybe they could lend me the ECU for an afternoon

ecarca · Jan 30, 2015

voicey said:
I take it you're not in the UK. Does your country have some kind of mandatory emissions testing? If so can you get someone to measure the hydrocarbons in your exhaust? If you actually have a misfire on one bank then the exhaust gas on that side will be full of HC. If you don't have HC then you have a sensor issue.

If you do have HC then there's loads of things that could cause it from a fault coil (cheap) to a broken valve spring (not so cheap).

We have a simple emission test, the car passed without the second cats that's all I know. Last time I went they did not even test it since the car is too low to get into their warehouse they just drove it around the block, tested the brakes and gave me the sticker... Will keep that in mind in case I can test this in the future.

I am anxiously waiting for the coils. I hope it will solve my problem.

ecarca · Feb 27, 2015

I replaced the 4 coils on bank 2 tonight. Now when I replug the MAF, I have misfire codes showing on bank 1!

I will go for a drive and confirm if codes are back on bank 2 or not. But when I tested quickly at idle, I only had misfires codes on bank 1: P0300, P0301 and P0303.

I also pulled a P1602, will check to see what it is, I got it once before.

I will also test the resistance on the coils. Interestingly, the resistance on the 4 new coils was the same as 2 coils I have lying around but it seems different than the one on the coils that were on the car, particularly cylinder 5. I will re measure everything to be sure and post a feedback.

ecarca · Feb 27, 2015

From what I found the P1602 points to: INTERNAL ECU MEMORY TABLE ERRORS...

I hope it is not the ECU. Anyway, I will do all what I said in the previous post and see what's going on.

ecarca · Feb 27, 2015

Update: exactly the same as before after a drive. P0300, P0308, P0307, P0305, P0306...
I guess the P1602 was because of the battery reset.
At idle: LTFT1 is 12.5 and LTFT2 -3.9...

Coil resistance are actually fairly the same on all the now 6 coils I have lying around...

Next step: CPS change.

Help needed: Misfires and other CEL's - Detailed account of the situation

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