2003 4200 Manual 4 sale

safrane

Member
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16,746
2003 4200 GT 4 sale

If anyone is looking for one of the above I am aware of one due to come onto the market soon.

Silver, low owner car with blue leather. Revised 2004 MY car with 7 spoke alloys.

Car is currently being prepped for sale at FTech Exeter and will be on their website soon.
 
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1,117
That's correct. I collected it this week. A GS LE form Dicky Grace. Early days with Cambio Corsa so went to talk to Marios at Autoshield to get his thoughts on how to drive it as I had several questions about making sure I prolong the clutch life (even though its got a new clutch) as I don't want to eat through a clutch quickly out of ignorance!

Marios was really helpful. Great guy. I'm glad he is near to me so I don't have to do B&B servicing and maintenance!
 
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Basically yes. But apparently they don't like being reversed up steep inclines. I adopt neutral at lights thinking that I wouldn't keep the Turbo in 1st egar with clutch down wearing the thrust bearing. But I have to remember to put foot on brake to upshift the paddle to 1st. Had some moments at traffic lights in neutral when I panicked it wouldn't go into first - then foot on brake and all OK to go into 1st. Its still weird after 200 miles. I still enjoy the gear stick experience, dropping from 4th to 2nd in one go blipping the throttle a la double de-clutching. The driving is different. I notice I can go in fast and come out fast in the Maser. The Porsche risks kicking its backside out if you try that - its always slow in, fast out (like a bullet out of corners). But I try to treat the CC clutch as I would a manual box clutch, with use of neutral at lights etc. In traffic I'm going to worry about abusing the clutch in crawling traffic like I got caught on the M6 North on Sunday.

Perhaps someone will be along and say "dont worry, they're not as brittle as you think" but I read stories of these clutches going at 20k miles and at £2.5k fitted they aint cheap (the porsche is £1.2k fitted).

I was asked which one do I prefer. Or which is best. My reply? They are different cars and enjoyable in different ways. The Porsche is a keeper. The Maser, I'll have to wait and see how I get on with the CC box and overall ownership experience. I the meantime, just driving around as much as I can before the really bad weather settles in and it will be pt on the CTEK charger and left for 6 weeks at a time.
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
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9,033
Basically yes. But apparently they don't like being reversed up steep inclines. I adopt neutral at lights thinking that I wouldn't keep the Turbo in 1st egar with clutch down wearing the thrust bearing.

Yes reversing up steep inclines is to be avoided at all cost.
You get that sinking feeling if say, pulling into an unknown drive that then goes downhill with no room to turnaround at the bottom!
It has been established that the clutch is disengaged whether in neutral or in gear, so no advantage to popping into neutral when stationary at say lights.
 
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1,117
That's useful to know. I didn't appreciate that the clutch is not engaged with foot on brake in 1st gear. So this is same as holding a manual box car in neutral with left foot off the clutch and right foot on brake?

On sunday I was cringing stuck in northbound M6 traffic. Travel a few yards. Stop. Travel a few feet but less than 1200rpm means clutch doesn't have chance to fully engage? Cringe. Cringe.

I was thinking such crawling traffic jams must mean the clutch takes a hammering as well as the thrust bearing.

So I went back on A roads where there wasn't stationary traffic.

Another query. In the manual box I 'd use braking and on fast driving shift from 5th to 3rd. In the CC box being sequential, dies the clutch take a hammering going to 4th then 3rd using engine braking?

Likewise, approaching roundabouts, is it better just to keep braking and let the car drop down through the box on its own without touching the paddles? I assume so and its better to use brakes rather than engine/gearbox braking?
 

safrane

Member
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16,746
You can skip gears by flicking the paddle more times....the ecu won't allow you to drop it lower than the box can manage...you can also go up the same way.
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
Messages
9,033
That's useful to know. I didn't appreciate that the clutch is not engaged with foot on brake in 1st gear. So this is same as holding a manual box car in neutral with left foot off the clutch and right foot on brake?

Yes, the clutch is not engaged with foot on brake in first gear, if it was, you would stall.
Sort off, when your left foot is off the clutch in neutral, the clutch plates are together, but with the cambiocorsa the clutch plates are open.

You can skip gears by flicking the paddle more times....the ecu won't allow you to drop it lower than the box can manage...you can also go up the same way.

Yes, the cambiocorsa is not a sequential gearbox, you can happily skip gears like you can with manual 'stick shift'.
You are simply using the paddles instead of a gear stick. One flick change up or down one gear, two flicks, change up or down missing a gear etc.
If you drive in auto, and use the 'kickdown', it will automatically change gear to the lowest available gear missing several gears if necessary....but hold on tight you are then under full power acceleration in the lowest available gear!
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
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9,033
Have you watched the official Maserati video on driving the cambiocorsa?
This came with my car when new on VHS cassette, that I uploaded a few years ago.
Should be a sticky somewhere really for new owners.

[video=youtube_share;_gV-J1OF_t4]http://youtu.be/_gV-J1OF_t4[/video]
 

CatmanV2

Member
Messages
48,539
That's useful to know. I didn't appreciate that the clutch is not engaged with foot on brake in 1st gear. So this is same as holding a manual box car in neutral with left foot off the clutch and right foot on brake?

On sunday I was cringing stuck in northbound M6 traffic. Travel a few yards. Stop. Travel a few feet but less than 1200rpm means clutch doesn't have chance to fully engage? Cringe. Cringe.

I was thinking such crawling traffic jams must mean the clutch takes a hammering as well as the thrust bearing.

So I went back on A roads where there wasn't stationary traffic.

Another query. In the manual box I 'd use braking and on fast driving shift from 5th to 3rd. In the CC box being sequential, dies the clutch take a hammering going to 4th then 3rd using engine braking?

Likewise, approaching roundabouts, is it better just to keep braking and let the car drop down through the box on its own without touching the paddles? I assume so and its better to use brakes rather than engine/gearbox braking?

1) No. As mentioned in Neutral, the CC box keeps the clutch plates apart. In a normal manual, the clutch plates are engaged with the foot off the clutch
2) You're right. Doesn't do the clutch the world of good. Let a gap of 3-4 car lengths open up then move forward. That will help
3) It's not sequential. In fact it's exactly the same box as fitted to the manual. Just has a computer and a load of hydraulics to move for you :) No more hammering than an normal manual if you do the same thing. I certainly used to :)
4) It depends. Some times I used to let the computer do it. If I was driving for fun, I'd shift a bit sooner so as to get a decent set of pops and bangs :)

Enjoy it!

C
 
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1,117
I just want to clarify: When I say clutch engaged, I mean the pedal pressed in a manual.
So in 1st gear on CC box with foot on brake, its like a manual box driver sitting with foot down on clutch pedal (wearing out the thrust bearing). In neutral with CC box its like a manual box driver sitting with gear in neutral, foot off the clutch pedal (no wear on thrust bearing) and handbrake on or foot on foot brake.

If I've described this correctly, then selecting neutral in a CC box with foot on brake saves thrust bearing wear?

I have the clip from You Tube with the promotion of CC box with Ivan Capelli.
But its quite superficial and doesn't really attempt to answer my questions.

The advice of leaving 3-4 car lengths in traffic jams is what I reverted to so I could get a run with the clutch full bite at 1200revs but jerks kept slipping into the space and pushing me further back - 1 step forward, three steps backwards!
 

CatmanV2

Member
Messages
48,539
I just want to clarify: When I say clutch engaged, I mean the pedal pressed in a manual.
So in 1st gear on CC box with foot on brake, its like a manual box driver sitting with foot down on clutch pedal (wearing out the thrust bearing). In neutral with CC box its like a manual box driver sitting with gear in neutral, foot off the clutch pedal (no wear on thrust bearing) and handbrake on or foot on foot brake.

If I've described this correctly, then selecting neutral in a CC box with foot on brake saves thrust bearing wear?

I have the clip from You Tube with the promotion of CC box with Ivan Capelli.
But its quite superficial and doesn't really attempt to answer my questions.

The advice of leaving 3-4 car lengths in traffic jams is what I reverted to so I could get a run with the clutch full bite at 1200revs but jerks kept slipping into the space and pushing me further back - 1 step forward, three steps backwards!

Most of us use clutch engaged to mean the plates are touching

But, no. When the CC is in neutral, the plates are still held apart, so there is no saving on thrust bearing wear. In short there is no way to save what wear on the thrust bearing there is.

BTW I think full engagement is 1800 rpm but really don't fret too much. You could drive 20k and have the fingers collapse on you with virtually no plate wear... I don't mean that to depress you, but rather to suggest you get on and enjoy one of the finest cars ever. You'll need to buy a clutch at some point :)
C
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
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9,033
If I've described this correctly, then selecting neutral in a CC box with foot on brake saves thrust bearing wear?

No, whether the CC Box is in neutral or sat in first gear, the clutch plates are apart.
There is no benefit in putting into neutral when stationary sat in traffic.

It is only when you switch off the engine in either neutral, first or reverse, does the clutch plates close.
You probably notice that when you do switch off the engine, it beeps at you if you are in neutral. You are supposed to switch off in gear, as a safety device 'engine brake' in case of handbrake failure.
The car will then automatically select neutral and open the clutch before starting the engine, then only if you have your foot on the brake too. It is impossible to start the car in gear.
 

Zep

Moderator
Messages
9,110
It's not exactly true that there is no benefit being in neutral at the traffic lights.

Depending on the PIS (the software holds the clutch just beyond the point of engagement as I understand it) there might be slight drag on the clutch. If the car is in gear the propshaft (torque tube if you prefer) is held still by the gear engagement, which means the clutch drag will wear the clutch a tiny amount.

In neutral the propshaft is free to turn slightly, which means any drag is taken up by the shaft being allowed to turn, preventing that tiny amount of wear. I also know that if my car idles for a long time (5 minutes or so) in neutral, the clutch engages, presumably to prevent wear to the thrust bearing. This is apparent by a change in noise from the thrust bearing - a slight rattling.

Lastly, I have been told that the collapsing clutch tangs were a bad batch. The story was that when these clutches were being installed at the dealers they couldn't be balanced using the SD3. They were replaced from a new batch and the dodgy ones returned to the spares department. It has been suggested that these items then made it into circulation by being sold into the trade. Just a story I heard.