ecarca
Junior Member
- Messages
- 320
PART 1, BACKGROUND
All right: I am finally taking time to write that troubleshoot thread. I need help because I am running out of ideas and already tried many things. I will try to be as precise as possible and to include all the details.
I mainly use the car in “sport” mode and I don’t think it matters for the problem. The first things I noticed after I took the car were the following:
After accelerating hard up then braking and downshifting to a complete stop, the engine tends to die on restart. It still happens but I believe this is related to clutch engagement, and giving a bit more throttle on restart. That could be linked to the problem down low in the rpm that I will describe extensively.
Other things I noticed back then were:
1. Some kind of rattle when the car was cold. It sounded like some kind of exhaust rattle but I tend to believe it is the clutch or flywheel. It only happens while driving at low rpm. There is some kind of light clunking sound. That sound has greatly attenuated since the recent changes (that I will detail as well).
2. A whining sound when going up a ramp, clearly the clutch I think and not too important.
3. A hesitation under 2000 rpm, that seemed to be clutch related but I don’t think it is after 3 months of troubleshooting.
This car has for sure been in a lot of stop and go traffic before and I now drive it in an hyper urban environment with similar conditions.
Besides, motorway driving is a breeze. Shifts are perfect, smooth and quick at speed, on the highway and while accelerating hard, the clutch does not slip. All the "problems" are low speed and low rpm related.
To summarize, the main symptoms were: idle ok, maybe slightly rough but really really slightly; there is a very slight vibration. If the car is cold and you press the throttle slightly, it will be kind of stutter-ish. This situation happens also while driving below 2000 rpm. When the car is warm, there is no apparent loss of power and the problem seems at least attenuated if not gone.
The DTC then were:
Multiple misfires and misfires on each cylinders: P0300, P0301, P0302, P0303, P0304, P0305, P0306, P0307, P0308
P0040: O2 Sensor Signals Swapped Bank 1 Sensor 1/Bank 2 Sensor 1
P1556: Fault at empty fuel tank/air injection sys
P2097: Post Catalyst Fuel Trim System Too Rich Bank 1
P2099: Post Catalyst Fuel Trim System Too Rich Bank 2
P2177: System Too Lean Off Idle Bank 1
These codes were not pulled together at the same time. The misfires are almost always here, the others take time to come. After the plugs change I only had P0300 to P0304. Then the rest of the P030X, and the P0040 and P2099 for the first time. The rest were pulled and cleared before.
What was done or checked back then: fresh service (all filters and fluids - the car drove better after), spark plugs changed, and dealership checked cats, vacuum leaks, intake leaks and fuel pumps, clutch (67%), battery. They put the misfire problem on bad fuel quality (supposedly used by the previous owner) and average condition spark plugs, which obviously sounds like easy scapegoats and said it was not a big issue.
My first leads were: Faulty O2 sensors, Catalytic converters, fueling: injectors or pumps.
Another thing is the coil packs were probably troubleshot before since I found 2 in a manufacturer's box in the trunk when I purchased the car.
I took pictures of the plugs afterwards. They are grouped by bank for sure but I don't know which one is bank one and which one is bank 2. They look fairly normal, still if they were all knew at the same time (unknown), one side looks a bit leaner than the other.
One bank:
Both banks:
The other bank:
The fuel trims were going crazy, with big corrections on both banks, either adding a lot or pulling a lot. LTFT were way too high... Both banks and not very consistent. I swapped the O2 sensors before purchasing new ones.
The things I did after the service and the plugs:
I put injectors cleaner. They said I need to put one for 5 tanks in a row, this is not a specific injector cleaner, this is the local thing made by Sinopec that cleans injectors, valves, etc… I don't know if it is any good.
I removed the injectors on both bank. The injectors were fairly clean compared to what I've seen on Internet. The spraying side was looking slightly dirty. Since I did not really have anything to clean it, I only cleaned the surface with WD40 (quick soaking and wiping) and hope the inside will clean itself with the solution I dilute in my tank. It is probably not very useful but better than nothing.
Pictures:
The last picture is what I wiped out, as you can see not too much but better on the tissue than on the injector...
I don’t know if it was placebo but the small hesitation seems to have smoothen a bit, only being there between 1000 and 1500 rpm instead of 1000 to 2000. The injectors on bank 2 were a bit dirtier than the ones on bank 1.
Then I replaced the 3 out of the 4 O2 sensors, one secondary was out of stock.
I also cleaned the MAF sensor. It did not look dirty at all.
The fuel consumption is definitely high, I am at 39.5 L/100 km on the last tank. It is in an hyper urban environment, driving like a madman and revving to the redline (cf. videos) but still I thought in that environment with that driving style I should be closer to 30L/100?
I think that I might replace the MAF since it definitely has to do something with Fuel injection but I don't think mine fails since the car works well past 2000 rpm. It could be off charts at best...
All right: I am finally taking time to write that troubleshoot thread. I need help because I am running out of ideas and already tried many things. I will try to be as precise as possible and to include all the details.
I mainly use the car in “sport” mode and I don’t think it matters for the problem. The first things I noticed after I took the car were the following:
After accelerating hard up then braking and downshifting to a complete stop, the engine tends to die on restart. It still happens but I believe this is related to clutch engagement, and giving a bit more throttle on restart. That could be linked to the problem down low in the rpm that I will describe extensively.
Other things I noticed back then were:
1. Some kind of rattle when the car was cold. It sounded like some kind of exhaust rattle but I tend to believe it is the clutch or flywheel. It only happens while driving at low rpm. There is some kind of light clunking sound. That sound has greatly attenuated since the recent changes (that I will detail as well).
2. A whining sound when going up a ramp, clearly the clutch I think and not too important.
3. A hesitation under 2000 rpm, that seemed to be clutch related but I don’t think it is after 3 months of troubleshooting.
This car has for sure been in a lot of stop and go traffic before and I now drive it in an hyper urban environment with similar conditions.
Besides, motorway driving is a breeze. Shifts are perfect, smooth and quick at speed, on the highway and while accelerating hard, the clutch does not slip. All the "problems" are low speed and low rpm related.
To summarize, the main symptoms were: idle ok, maybe slightly rough but really really slightly; there is a very slight vibration. If the car is cold and you press the throttle slightly, it will be kind of stutter-ish. This situation happens also while driving below 2000 rpm. When the car is warm, there is no apparent loss of power and the problem seems at least attenuated if not gone.
The DTC then were:
Multiple misfires and misfires on each cylinders: P0300, P0301, P0302, P0303, P0304, P0305, P0306, P0307, P0308
P0040: O2 Sensor Signals Swapped Bank 1 Sensor 1/Bank 2 Sensor 1
P1556: Fault at empty fuel tank/air injection sys
P2097: Post Catalyst Fuel Trim System Too Rich Bank 1
P2099: Post Catalyst Fuel Trim System Too Rich Bank 2
P2177: System Too Lean Off Idle Bank 1
These codes were not pulled together at the same time. The misfires are almost always here, the others take time to come. After the plugs change I only had P0300 to P0304. Then the rest of the P030X, and the P0040 and P2099 for the first time. The rest were pulled and cleared before.
What was done or checked back then: fresh service (all filters and fluids - the car drove better after), spark plugs changed, and dealership checked cats, vacuum leaks, intake leaks and fuel pumps, clutch (67%), battery. They put the misfire problem on bad fuel quality (supposedly used by the previous owner) and average condition spark plugs, which obviously sounds like easy scapegoats and said it was not a big issue.
My first leads were: Faulty O2 sensors, Catalytic converters, fueling: injectors or pumps.
Another thing is the coil packs were probably troubleshot before since I found 2 in a manufacturer's box in the trunk when I purchased the car.
I took pictures of the plugs afterwards. They are grouped by bank for sure but I don't know which one is bank one and which one is bank 2. They look fairly normal, still if they were all knew at the same time (unknown), one side looks a bit leaner than the other.
One bank:
Both banks:
The other bank:
The fuel trims were going crazy, with big corrections on both banks, either adding a lot or pulling a lot. LTFT were way too high... Both banks and not very consistent. I swapped the O2 sensors before purchasing new ones.
The things I did after the service and the plugs:
I put injectors cleaner. They said I need to put one for 5 tanks in a row, this is not a specific injector cleaner, this is the local thing made by Sinopec that cleans injectors, valves, etc… I don't know if it is any good.
I removed the injectors on both bank. The injectors were fairly clean compared to what I've seen on Internet. The spraying side was looking slightly dirty. Since I did not really have anything to clean it, I only cleaned the surface with WD40 (quick soaking and wiping) and hope the inside will clean itself with the solution I dilute in my tank. It is probably not very useful but better than nothing.
Pictures:
The last picture is what I wiped out, as you can see not too much but better on the tissue than on the injector...
I don’t know if it was placebo but the small hesitation seems to have smoothen a bit, only being there between 1000 and 1500 rpm instead of 1000 to 2000. The injectors on bank 2 were a bit dirtier than the ones on bank 1.
Then I replaced the 3 out of the 4 O2 sensors, one secondary was out of stock.
I also cleaned the MAF sensor. It did not look dirty at all.
The fuel consumption is definitely high, I am at 39.5 L/100 km on the last tank. It is in an hyper urban environment, driving like a madman and revving to the redline (cf. videos) but still I thought in that environment with that driving style I should be closer to 30L/100?
I think that I might replace the MAF since it definitely has to do something with Fuel injection but I don't think mine fails since the car works well past 2000 rpm. It could be off charts at best...
